It’s always classy to throw someones protocol or symptoms back in their face. You do that alot. So does Natway. How on earth do you expect people to post honest updates if people like you bring up their problems as proof that what they are doing doesn’t work. For someone who complained that Natway was killing a supportive forum ... you might not want to copy his behavior.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Same as Pam Killeen. She is incredibly qualified. Plus, all the new people have to work with Dr Wilson for a long time. The newbies do not interpret by themselves. There is a report from the lab, and Dr Wilson looks at it as well. Dav1e... There is indeed such a thing as hidden copper. As well as hidden aluminum, lead, mercury, etc. I had them all hidden. When you is very weak, the 1st hair analysis often shows ZERO toxins. That is because when your body is weak and your ability to clear toxins is limited, it does not even make an attempt to remove them. I showed almo ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Once you start to actually detox, it can take a very long time.   For me, copper, mercury, lead, arsenic, and aluminum have all been trending up in my hair as I detox.  Going on over 2.5 years, and they are all still climbing.  So I guess my body is getting better at clearing toxins. My zinc levels in my hair have been steady the whole time.   Although I have had symptoms of zinc deficiency (white spots on nails). Even though your zinc levels may be fine, copper excess will produce zinc deficiency symptoms.         [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Back in 2004, when I first crashed, I was at the very high end for morning blood cortisol. I pondered the Cushings thing as well for a while. If you google Cortisol Steal ... you’ll get a hint of what may be going on. I think what happens as you slip into Stage 3 is that your adrenals are not making much.... but all available resources go to cortisol since you are stuck in a state of stress. A saliva test might show low progesterone, but high cortisol. People often have signs of low aldosterone (low blood pressure, salt craving, dehydration) .... but still have high ...
[retrieve this message]

---

That’s a good sign they are brown. It means you are releasing bile, and the toxins they contain. My bowel were almost white a few years when I would take zinc. THAT was pretty scary since it looked like my body was removing zero toxins.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Yeah. I see what you are saying. The need for Vitamin C is much greater during infections, allergies, or any other stressor. The Book ”Curing the Incurable” talks about how effective Vitamin C is for dealing with such things. You are not super high in dosage. I still a short term high dose Vitamin C if I feel a cold or flu coming on. I guess only use use a high dose when you really need it. I think it is better to stick to regular Vitamin C that will be limited somewhat by bowel tolerance. The Liposomal C doesn’t get limited by bowel tolerance, so it is more likely ...
[retrieve this message]

---

actually... If you are taking 3000 mg of Vitamin C, you are not on Wilson or ARL protocol. Vitamin C is such a good Chelator, it doesnt just target copper. It can unbalance other minerals as well. Dr Roth of Acucell agrees with Wilson on that one. They have both seen it in their respective mineral analysis.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Vitamin C is a strong chelator. But yes...your liver needs to able to clear it. What color are your bowel movements   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

For me, it was insomnia, psoriasis, headaches behind my eyes. I had periods of stiff neck, low back pain. A lot of people get increased anxiety. This never happened to me. I went through periods of being very cold, even in the summer. Copper has a negative impact on thyroid function. I had white bowel movements a couple of years ago. Was not releasing enough bile. The coffee enemas are super helpful for reducing detox symptoms. Really just about anything is possible. Some people get nausea, balance problems. If you aren’t already, make sure you are doing your ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I do take 500 mg of TMG per day. To be honest, I didn’t notice anything good or bad.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Well. All of Pam’s clients are guided towards a Weston Price, Ancestral Diet. Lots of butter, creme cheese, all the land animals. As much grass fed as you can find. She even has a couple of ex-vegetarians. They have a harder time getting their gallblader going again. I dont know how many are here in this forum. Many people have left this forom since it is hard to mix TEI advice with ARL advice, and the various sub-sets within them. Even for people in the four lows .... she gets right into the animal fats. And she has done so for years. So it is possible to mix the two
[retrieve this message]

---

Holy crap .. that's a lot of pressure. I lost hair from my arms and legs years ago.  There is a major connective tissue problem with adrenal fatigue.   Still have a head of hair like Joseph Stalin, however. When I started TMG, I did not notice any extra hair loss.     [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

ok. Have never really looked into into it too much. I am probably close to it, but I don’t try, or do any counting.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

yup. Did the same thing myself a few years ago. Thyroid support is hard on your adrenals. L-tyrosine is a bit of a stimulant as well. It is a non essential amino acid.... meaning the body can make it if it thinks it should. My theory is that it is similar to shutting down the thyoid. Your body might down regulate L tyrosine production since it cant handle the energy. Dont know for sure ...but it didnt go well when I tried it back 2008. For some people the saliva test can change from day to day. It depends a little on how much activity you are doing. mine was gene ...
[retrieve this message]

---

A few people on Pam Killeens group are full keto. To me that is not natural either. I havent done any research to back that up. But complete avoidance of any whole food just doesnt seem normal to me. I am grass fed animal fat heavy.. and eat some carbs too.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Do a little research on what happens to adrenal hormones during arousal and cllmax.  It is a stressor, and it boosts adrenal hormones.   Anything that is exciting boosts adrenal hormones is more attractive when you are deficient.  It makes you feel good for a little while. That’s why addiction is fairly common with adrenal fatigue.  Thrill seeking of any kind is no different than hit of strong coffee.  Nice sort term hit of energy, with longer term costs for those with adrenal fatigue. So I think he is on the money with that one. Lots of other experts promote ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi LOL Mart, That form is a little bit Type-A. :)   That's ok ...it takes one to know one.   And a pretty common trait for us adrenal fatigue folks.  Made me smile. I started copper detox a little over 2.5 years ago.  First started Cutler protocol, which was too fast for me. Tried TEI and Ann-Louise Giddleman for about 9 months.  Switched to Pam Killeen, who has sort of tweaked Dr Wilsons protocol, so much that he took her off his list of practitioners (mostly related to diet)   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Good to know Tena Cious. I guess nothing works for everyone. The coffee enemas didn’t help immediately. But copper is pro-inflammatory, zinc is anti-inflammatory. Lord knows I dumped a lot of zinc from my prostate over the years by ejaculating. So it might be that gradually the zinc/copper in my prostate is improving. I used to have to use an ice pack on my groin at night to go to sleep.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

”but you started the argument with your touchy persona” Again .. given your history of negative posts regarding copper detox as a protocol, don’t you think that is to be expected. How touchy are you with Natway about the existence of adrenal fatigue? So yes, I am on the defensive with you on this subject. You chased Natway to his other forum because he got under your skin in regards to the existence of adrenal fatigue. So you are not quite a Zen master either :) I do see that NB doesn’t work out for everyone. It is a slow path, and the detox can make things worse for a lo ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I was on that group. You were definitely arguing with everyone. It’s been a couple of years. I remember it getting heated, and you were gone. If you left on your own accord, fine. I apologize. I know Marie was tapering. I don’t know that she completely came off. Umm... Dr Wilson is a little different than Hilter. So that analogy is a little off. He is sexist for sure, but he is trying to help people for very little money.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Copper blocks GABA receptors, which is another explaination of how copper directly increases anxiety. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10864892 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12566921 Maybe that is why reducing estrogen dominance reduces anxiety. Higher estrogen leads to higher copper, which leads to blocked GABA receptors.   Just don't act so cocksure in you knowledge.   Because you sound like you know who. You have a tiny sliver of knowledge.  So do I.     [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Not sure you were really on the Facebook long enough to make that judgement call regarding success rate.  You were removed for badgering people on a support forum :) It takes a long time to detox.  Below is a trend of my copper over the last 2.5 years. 8 times the top of the reference range.  Still trending up. Aluminum, mercury, arsenic, lead are all trending up as well.  As I continue to get better, they are coming out faster. Yet I still feel good since the coffee enemas keep stimulating bile flow to clear what is being pulled into circulation. ...
[retrieve this message]

---

”I simply through in another angle of the Prog cream.” If you had described it as another angle, another possible factor ..that would have been fine. But you didn’t. Go back and read your wording. ”I doubt very much it have much to do with free roaming copper” Do that sound like just tossing out another possibility? Nope. That is directly discrediting my point. If I constantly took jabs at your Benzo/GABA theories, I am pretty sure you would be touchy too. You actually attacked a positive update of mine a few months ago. Trying to explain away my progress with NB ...
[retrieve this message]

---

That is interesting. I’ve never heard anyone mention that type of breathing problem. It’s also odd to be calm if your adrenal fatigue is very bad. I just looked up MMS. Had never heard of it. The NB folks usually don’t like when you try a bunch of other minerals, since it will affect the program. So I doubt there is much experience combining the two.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

”I doubt very much it have much to do with free roaming copper” This is because you continue to discount copper and didn’t read or think about the links I posted. ”But you still haven’t answered my question and I’m curious why? If going by what you saying, am I poisoning myself daily by rubbing my skin over copper for two hours a day while having a damaged detoxification system? So playing the guitar is causing me anxiety and insomnia by elevating my blood (and therefore cellular level after prolonged exposure content of copper? This is what you are kinda stating.” Now you are ju ...
[retrieve this message]

---

It wasn't immediate at all.  It took two weeks before the anxiety stopped after starting progesterone cream. And in when I stopped the progesterone cream in preparation for some lab work, it took two weeks for the anxiety to return. We all have our own little bit of knowledge, and we tend to think that our little bit of knowledge is THE answer. You are definitely the Benzo man.  I don't even know what Benzos are :) Seriously ... I don't.   Never took them, so no need to learn about them. But with all due re ...
[retrieve this message]

---

By the way, good luck with Dr. Randall Tent. I am not saying that NB is the only way to pull out of this.   If you can calm your nervous system and get some energy back, your body should start detoxifying again. It's just that Dr Wilson "goes at" the toxins directly, since they are a burden for the body, and may limit how much energy you are able to get.   And I didn't mean to sound condescending by saying you are looking for a quick fix.  It's just really common for a few years.   People show up panicky at firs ...
[retrieve this message]

---

If your breathing is 2 out of 10, I assume you mean you have: -shortness of breath -can’t hold your breath -take sudden gasps of air These are signs of chronic sub-conscious hyperventilation. Very common symptom of chronic stress. Hyperventilation leads to a lot of secondary symptoms due to peripheral neuropathy (flashes of light, numb hands, cold extremities) If you look through my old posts, I solved this with Buteyko Breathing. It helps alot, but more is needed. With all due respect, I hear a lot from adrenal fatigue folks ”I can’t meditate” That is like saying I ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi, I agree that he does have lot’s of opinions. But no doctor that treats adrenal fatigue is right about everything. I believe he is wrong about about a few things as well. But overall, the program seems to work more than it doesn’t work. You can try to find a ”speedy” program, but I haven’t really seen any that work very well. Dr Lam promised me a speedy recovery, but after 2 years with him, I moved on. At least Dr Wilson is being honest about the time it take. Not just telling people what they want to hear. If you believe that chronic stress creates mineral def ...
[retrieve this message]

---

It is probably a bit of both. I don't think it's all brain. Being stuck in a state of stress from epigenetics or another other reasons is a factor. That's why my entire family has AF, even those that didn't have very stressful lives.   Here is a study where they exposed future chicken parents to stress.  Many stress related genes became activated in the parents (epigenetics). http://www.plosone.org/article/fetchArticle.action?articleURI=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0000364 The offspring of these stressed parents had the same genes act ...
[retrieve this message]

---

It might just be that stress causes increased urine flow ... whether or not your adrenals can actually respond to the request to produce hormones. For me, the frequent urination stopped in the spring of  2011, after doing lots of meditation and breathing exercises.   It might come back if I've had a stressful day, but only lasts for that day. Interestingly enough, I still had dehydration at this point.  i.e. no sweating. So it might have more to do with stress than low aldosterone. Here is a study where they noted increased urine flow ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Yeah. It is more than aldosterone. High cortisol reduces the hormone ADH, which makes us dump fluids as well   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

That’s true. In fact, in early Stage 2, one might even feel better than normal, when your body is pumping out above normal levels of hormones. When I look back on my early 20s, right up to about 33, I was clearly wired. I had the reflexes of a cat. Clearly stuck in sympathetic dominant mode. But I felt great, was super active At the gym that called me the ant, since I could lift so much weight. Probably because my adrenals were pumping out higher than normal adrenaline (epinephrine). I could handle any amount of stress. Literally felt almost super-human in my early 30s. ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I do the Caster oil for about 30 minutes. I got lots of stones the first few flushes, not many the last couple. I guess that is common. It doesn’t cause any insomnia for me, but I suppose it could if it really stirs things up   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I guess no doctor is 100% right about everything.  It seems especially around diet that there are many conflicting theories and studies. And it takes a lot to change ones opinion about diet, especially when you were promoting a diet for years and have to face that you may have wrong for years.  But the low fat fear is slowly being chipped away at.     But the core of the program, which is remineralizing the body, getting rid of toxins seems to be pretty effective.   For caster oil ... it's pretty simple.  Soak a plain flannel ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Don’t be envious.  That particular emotion is a source of stress :) Mine didn’t start speedy at all.  Here are my copper values over the last 2.5 years.  I am about to mail off another one. 6.5, 8.7, 10.2, 13.5, 12.1, 15.2, 7.7, 18.4,  24.2 Everything else is slowly trending up as well (mercury, arsenic, lead).  I was a very poor eliminator when I started.  Pale bowel movements, almost white bowel movements when I started taking zinc. It took a couple of months of coffee enemas before I heard the first gallbladder squi ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Did you try searching the forum?   I don't recall a lot of "chatter" around this issue, but you might find something.   I personally had better luck with progesterone than pregnenolone a few years ago. Sorry I couldn't be of more help.   By the way ... the search function for Curezone completely sucks.  I usually use plain old Google, but limit it to Curezone by doing the following: pregnenolone site:http://curezone.com/forums   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

A few years ago, I was able to resolve the shortness of breath and other hyperventilation symptoms with Buteyko Breathing.   It takes a while, but it is helpful. It doesn't really get to the root cause, but it does reduce all the symptoms than can come from subconscious hyperventilation.  Here is a great online questionaire for hyperventilation.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I had peripheral tingling. Peripheral neuropathy can cause tingling. There are a couple of things that I know of that can cause peripheral neuropathy. Hypoglycemia, which is common for adrenal fatigue since you can’t produce the increase in cortisol when needed to raise blood sugar. Hypoglemcia usually happens in the afternoon for AF folks since that is when cortisol is often low, but some people get hypoglycemia at other times. Hyperventilation can also cause peripheral neuropathy. Chronic stress can cause subconscious hyperventilation. I used to get numb tingling hands and ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I find if I retain them too long, I will absorb the coffee into my blood stream and get insomnia. But if I only hold it for 15-minutes, it does its job of stimulating bile flow ... without the problem of getting too much in the blood stream. If I hold it too long, I actually don’t expel much of it. My last copper was 24! Still increasing.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

There is no question they help clear toxins. My wife hadn’t had any detox symptoms for a couple of months. She went away for 4 days. She kept taking her supplements, but wasn’t able to do the CEs. After 3 days, her detox symptoms started again ... metallic taste in her mouth, headaches, nausea, aching legs. One of my sisters is very copper toxic. Sky high on her HTMA. She tried NB for 1-year, but could not stand the coffee enemas. And she was having metallic taste, balance problems, nausea .... so she stopped. There is the odd person that CEs seem to make detox worse. ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi Wired.    You said it a few times. They are his BELIEFS.   Beliefs do NOT make someone insane. Rick Santorum has some beliefs that I might think are crazy.  But there he was at the presidential debates with a shot at becoming president.  Look up some of his quotes. I wouldn`t want Rick as the president, because his beliefs will influence public policy.   To my dismay ... a significant portion of the population was perfectly fine with his social views. In fact, they elected him as a Senator.   ...
[retrieve this message]

---

It is not intuitive at all .... but the sicker you are,  the less toxins you will initially have in your hair.  This is because your body doesn't have the energy to try to remove them.  Your body is not even attempting to eliminate toxins. Every practitioner should know this ..  but some are better than others. I started about 2.5 years doing copper detox after reading Giddlemans book.   Then I switched Nutrition   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

A lot of people loss muscle mass when stuck in a state of stress. However, high cortisol can cause you to put on weight around your waist.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Anca ....one more thing to consider if you haven't already.   After years of chronic stress, your body will have accumulated lots of toxins.  These toxins themselves start to become a burden and a source of stress. Copper is a big one because there is a lot of it in food.  However, with stress and adrenal fatigue, we don't remove excess amounts quickly enough. The following book "Why Am I Always So Tired"   covers stress, adrenal fatigue and copper toxicity.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Good Luck Anca.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

The gut problems sure were brutal. Had them about 5 years ago. Gas, cramps, pain.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Cool. I didn’t know that Ginger was an adaptogen. I use it as a spread mixed with butter. Tastes great.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi Anca. Are you jumpy? Do you startle easy?  if you are, you are stuck in a state of stress. Fat in the abdominal area can come from high cortisol.  Cortisol seems to be the last hormone to fall with adrenal fatigue. Do you get more energy late in the evening, but run out of energy in the afternoon?  Do you have the afternoon energy crash? If you had trouble sleeping, that can be a sign of stress signalling at night.  People often have high cortisol in the morning (higher than normal), but low cortisol in the afternoon. If you are n ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Some people have done ok with Ashawaganda. Rhodiola is a stimulant. Ginseng is a stimulant. If you search around the forum, you will find they often result in a crash.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Back when I needed it, I found progesterone more helpful.  I took progesterone for about 5.5 years.   It takes a couple of weeks to notice the affects for progesterone.   Others have noticed pregnenolone helps them.     I am not a woman.  For you, your progesterone levels are supposed to make large changes through your cycle.     [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I had a similar experience with Rhodiola. Feel great for a week or so, then crash hard. It is essentially a stimulant. There are lots of studies showing it ”helps resistance to stress”. But it seems to do so by stimulating. The people that put this in products don’t really understand adrenal fatigue. I tried the ”balance neurotransmitter” method back in about 2007. I didn’t get anywhere, and I have not seen anyone else succeed with this method. It is essentially treating a symptom anyway. We are all a little different. But work we can all benefit from meditation, mindf ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Back in 2007, a saliva test showed low progesterone, even though my cortisol was high. I tried progesterone cream and it completely stopped my anxiety and panic attacks. Good luck.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Salt doesn't increase Aldosterone.  It is the other way around.  You need to calm your nervous system such that everything doesn't go to cortisol. And people lose their salt craving one they improve.  I lost my salt craving about a year ago after 10 years of salting my water and using lots and lots of salt on my food. Something like Seriphos can be helpful to reduce cortisol.  Generally, you take it when your saliva test show high cortisol ... and not when your saliva test shows low cortisol. A lot of people have low cortisol in the aftern ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Glad you are doing better. Stop by and keep us posted once in a while   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

For dehydration test...pull the skin on the back of your hand. If it is slow to bounce back, that is a good sign. But you can’t just drink lots and lots of water, since that will just flush out minerals you are probably already deficient in   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Here is a nice little chart on cortisol steal.     [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

It is really high Aldosterone that leads to high blood pressure. Aldosterone retains fluids. What happens when you are stuck in a state of stress, but have weak adrenals is ”cortisol steal” (google it). Your adrenal are not producing much ... but what they are producing is all going towards cortisol. So progesterone, aldosterone, and other hormones may be low, even though cortisol is high (or at least high in the morning). In earlier stages of adrenal fatigue (stage 2), you might have both high cortisol and high aldosterone. But once you start craving salt ... you are proba ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi, There is definitely a physiological impact from chronic stress. PTSD is not just psychological. Chronic stress damages the body is so many ways.  Your immune system stops, detoxification stops, even menstrual cycles stop for a lot of women. Do you have a exaggerated startle response? i.e. are you jumpy?  If you do, that means you sympathetic nervous system is dominant. Meditation, Yoga and "slow breathing" are very helpful.  Very helpful.  It can take a few months to notice.   But you need to meditate twice p ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi, Sorry you are going through this. Same thing happened to me back in 2008. One doctor put me on Armour thyroid and HC. I was quickly becoming much worse. Luckily, I spoke to Dr Rind, who advised me to stop supporting the thyroid since my adrenals sounded too weak to be able to handle it. I could not even take Kelp for thyroid support for several years. It would cause an adrenal crash. I went a different path, so I can’t help you out too much in regards to balancing thyroid meds and HC. Do you have an exaggerated startle response? ie, are you jumpy? If you do, ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi Omo, You are correct. It is the ego that results in us being offended, angry, envious, etc. Pretty much all negative emotions which activate the stress response. Meditation is a great help from two perspectives. You get better at catching yourself in these states,and then just let them go. You learn to not let your ego take you for a ride. Second, you can use meditation to cultivate more positive mental states, so that the negative ones happen less often.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi Omo I was Googling Glutathione and Copper and actually found this post of yours.   You are correct.  Bile flow is very important.  It is how we get rid of toxins.  The lady I doing Nutritional Balancing with puts a lot of emphasis on getting bile flowing again.  (lemon water, eating some grapefruit, coffee enemas, flushes) For the last year or so, I get lots of gallbladder sounds under my right rib.  At first I would only hear it during coffee enemas.  Then I started to hear it during other times. From 2008 to 2011, I did ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I have found coffee enemas very helpful for reducing detox symptoms. I could not handle any zinc until I started coffee enemas (zinc pulls copper out of storage.... creating the opposite affects that zinc should). The coffee enemas seemed to help clear the copper that was being pulled out by zinc supplements. The cutler protocol was too fast for me. I have been doing nutritional balancing for about 2.5 years. All toxic metals continue to trend higher and higher in my hair as I get better .... indicating they are being removed at a faster and faster rate from storage. If yo ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Yup. Meditation is super important .. and free. Start with ”concentration meditation”, such as breath counting. Concentration meditation calms your nervous system ... but only while you are doing it. It is training for the next type, which is mindfulness. The ultimate goal is to be mindful 24/7. You gradually get better at catching yourself spiraling into anger, envy, impatience, etc. All the negative emotions that increase stress hormones. It takes a while to retrain your brain so that the limbic system is not so dominant. Try doing everything in slow motion. Wash your ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Ephedrine is a pretty strong stimulant.  And so is over training.  They would be strong contributing factors.  But there is likely other factors in your life as well. Do you startle easy?  Do you jump when the phone rings for example.   Are you impatient?  Do you worry all the time about everything?  Did you go through years of feeling like you HAD to being doing something productive and could not just relax and do nothing. These are signs of your nervous system being stuck in sympathetic dominant mode.     [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I had this for years too. I felt tired from 6 pm to 9 pm, but as soon as I would lay down in bed, I was wide awake. It seems to be a common symptom. And for some reason, so is resisting going to bed when tired in the evening.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

twinkl.... be careful with exercise. Many people have halted their recovery by exercising too hard too soon. Exercise does put quite a strain on your adrenals if you do it to the point that your heart rate increases. Glad you are doing well. Just something to consider for you.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I’m doing pretty well. I never really gave the Biotuner a fair shake. I only used it for about a week. But I have been sleeping like a baby for the last several months. I have really stepped up the meditation. Basically 1-hr total per day, and non-stop mindfulness when not sitting in meditation. I think that is really the point of mindfulness. Training to catch yourself spiraling into negative emotions at any time. Anger, envy, and all those negative emotions put us in fight or flight. Need to do a fresh post on that in more detail on the meditation techniques are help ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi Wired. Yup. I’m just not going to get drawn into any debates. It’s just not worth it.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Yes. Sounds like you should make sure you have lots of sodium. Your body needs to produce aldosterone to retain sodium. So it sort of becomes a stressor if your potassium levels increase and your adrenals try to response to produce aldosterone. It’s why craving sodium is so common. I craved salt for years. As my adrenals are improving, I have lost my salt craving. Don’t overdo the magnesium. It lowers sodium. Some people crash after doing Epsom salts baths (which has a lot of magnesium). Same for using too much magnesium oil. If you are not doing so already, try t ...
[retrieve this message]

---

It can be good to confirm that you do have abnormalities in your adrenal hormones   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

have you read this book yet? http://www.amazon.com/Adrenal-Fatigue-Century-Stress-Syndrome/dp/1890572152/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1398539651&sr=8-1&keywords=adrenal+fatigue It's not perfect.  But it's a great place to start.   There is a lot to learn. This is a good book as well.     [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Have you tried a saliva test yet?   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Yup. Back in 2007, I started using progesterone cream. After about 1.5 weeks, my anxiety completely stopped. Didn’t know exactly why, but it probably helped reduce the amount of copper I was retaining. It was a real savior. I was about to quite work in 2007 since I could barely function I took progesterone cream from 2007 until about early 2012. I don’t need it anymore, but it sure helped me function. Not many people seem to try progesterone. But the beauty of taking progesterone instead of pregnenolone is that it is further down the hormone cascade, so it is not subje ...
[retrieve this message]

---

It can tell you information you wouldnt have otherwise. For example .... if you are experiencing ”Cortisol Steal”, your progesterone could be low, even though everything else doesn’t look too bad. I had that in one saliva test.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

do you have afternoon energy crashes? do you get sfternoon hypoglycemia the low afternoon cortisol is pretty common.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I took liposomal glutathione as part of Lams program for a couple of years. It is possible that when you tried is and got increased symptoms (anxiety and shortness of breath), that it was due to increased detox. The shortness of breath can be a sign of sub-conscious hyperventilation, which can be caused by stress. I personally never really noticed much good or bad from the liposomal gluathione .... other than a massive drain on the bank account. It didn’t really seem to help my clearance issues. I still had almost white bowel movements, and my skin was scaly all over. ...
[retrieve this message]

---

How about this one. :) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16117823   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

That’s awesome Sherpa! So happy for you. Well done   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

99.9% of doctors do not undestand. It is usually only the ones that went through it themskeves that do. A couple of good books are ”Adrenal Fatigue” by James Wilson and ”Why Am I always so tired” by Giddleman. The wired and tired feeling you describe is common. Your mind is wired.... but your body is exhausted. I have been making slow steady progress over the last 3 years. There are lots of different approaches. Meditation is essential to calming your nervous system down. No protocol works for everyone. Good luck to you. There is a lot to learn.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Where exactly have you seen thousands of these tests? With both companies. Did you work for both ARL and TEI?   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

If you had the afternoon energy crash, you might also want to try a (4) point saliva test. It will likely show cortisol abnormalities. Do you get a little boost of energy near bed time?   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Are you jumpy? Do you have an exaggerated startle response? Do you get irritated easily? Do you have afternoon or early evening energy crashes? Do you have Brain Fog? These are some of the most common symptoms I agree with c.b. Coffee alone would not do it. It is a stressor. But it usually take more than that to end up here   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

HC is a double edged sword. If you really need it to function on a short term basis....then do it. But you should look around the forum for others that have used it. Many seem to regret it long term. Just so a search on the forum. Good luck.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

The Good: Green Tea has L-theanine in it, which reduces the effect of caffeine. The Bad:  It has caffeine The Ugly: Depending on where it is from, green tea, and other other tea can contain lead and other toxins. http://www.theprovince.com/health/Lead+other+toxins+found+have+researchers+advising+pregnant+women+severely+reduce+consumption/9237967/story.html Some teas  have a very high uptake rate of toxins.    Holy Basil can be very high in chromium. http://ratetea.com/style/tulsi/133/   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

nice symptom list.....had many of these myself   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Hi Omo, No, I don’t add any addition water. Just the original 7 to 8 oz that was used to brew the coffee. If I am in a rush, I might throw in a few ice cubes to cool it down, but that doesn’t add a lot of volume. I do not notice any stimulation. I am able to do them in the evening and not affect my sleep. Most of the liquid comes right back out after retaining for 15-minutes. It seems that if you lay on your right side or back, don’t use too much water, and don’t retain too long, the stimulation not noticeable. I very rarely will have a small cup of coffee if I need to ...
[retrieve this message]

---

you should check out the book ”why am I always so tired” by griddleman. She changed her thinking after becoming sick and doing lots of research. one reason is the plant based protein is high in copper and low in zinc. combined with chronic stress and adrenal fatigue.... it’s a deadly combo for copper toxicity and zinc deficiency. another reason is you need animal fat to trigger the release of bile for digestion. if you are not releasing much bile .... your main detox pathway becomes inactive. (bile is also how toxins are released) this is why when vegans start eating animal ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I’ve only used HC cream on a short term basis a few years ago when I would have severe reactions to wood dust or other things. Just for a few days each time to prevent anaphylactic shock. I used to carry a tube with me if I had to go into a sawmill for work. But I do remember someone on the forum a couple of years ago on this forum mentioning they were using it for daily maintenance. Can’t remember who or exactly when. Sorry you had a crash. Hopefully you bounce back.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Cool.  That's great it worked for you.  Sometimes I forget to do it myself. Here is one of the meditation books I've read.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

all of us formerly high energy people like to be efficient. It a symptom (and cause) of a wound up nervous system. Try not to be proud of being efficient . oddly enough, I find when I slow down and focus, I get more done. Trying to do everything quickly ..... you end up looking like a squirrel running around and you make a lot of mistakes. Be proud of being calm :). It is a fundamental change in attitude that we need to make. stop trying to be the hardest worker, the fastest, the most motivated, etc Meditation does not increase cortisol. But is does calm your nervous s ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I am on the iPad. so a bit of a pain in the but to find a link. But if you go a amazon, I think the is a book called meditation for beginners. ultimately, you want to move towards mindfulness meditation so that you are always watching and observing yourself. This is how you get good at catching yourself getting angry, panicky, envious, etc.....all the negative emotions that create stress   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Lots and lots of meditation can help to calm your nervous system. And practicing non-stop mindfulness to make sure you are moving slow when doing things (folding clothes, washing dishes, etc) Practice slow breathing. I need to get back at it. I had calmed my startle response down to the point that I was not jumpy at all. Good luck   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

I used to have balance problems, but I haven't had it for a couple of years. My wife had some balance and vertigo issues at the same time as other detox symptoms kicked in (metallic taste, rash).    There are probably a few things that can cause it.  When I was heavy in researching  neurotransmitters, I believe I read that low dopamine can cause balance issues.   And a couple of test from Integrative psychiatry showed low dopamine a few years ago. And from a metals / detox perspective, people also seem to get this symptom.  ...
[retrieve this message]

---

Yup.   I just did a back to back. (6) table spoons..     Any now time for bed.  :) But I will say, there are others who say the have trouble sleeping if the do them in the evening. It is not supposed to be Decaf.  I can’t remember the exact reasons why ... would have to look them up again.  Been a couple of years since I thought about it. I retain for 15-minutes.  I do a 15-minute meditation at the same time. I use a French press to make it.  I don’t dilute it any more.  Although if I am in a rush, I’ll throw in some ice cubes just to cool it down more quickl ...
[retrieve this message]

---

I have been doing them twice per day for a couple of years as part of nutritional balancing. I don’t find them stimulating, not if they are done properly. Don’t lay on your left side like you would for a normal enema. Lay on your right side or back. Don’t use too much water. I use about 7-oz. Don’t retain too long. I can do a coffee enema before bed, and it doesn’t affect my sleep. And I am using (3) heaping teaspoons of SA Wilson coffee. They have definitely help improve my clearance. I had lite beige bowels movements for years.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

Yeah. My sodium did spike up at the same time as copper and mercury first took a jump up. So it makes sense that they were stimulating adrenal activity in order to deal with the stress of detoxing. But then sodium dropped again   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

well. that is a pretty good jump. it’s possible. I am not even close to an expert. My main point was that I did coffee enemas for a long time with no drop on electrolytes.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

yup.Sherpa is correct. .. if you are not ready for thyroid support, you can make your adrenals worse. happened to a few people here.   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---

2 years   [End]
[retrieve this message]

---