Fasting Update 
lauray
15 years ago
1,803
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Hi, Forum,
I have not posted in a while, but I wanted to write about my progress. I feel a bit scared and vulnerable since I have received such abusive reactions to posts I have made here, and got really "controlled" (as well as abusively talked about, and rather abusively talked to, or intimidated) by others on the Water Fasting forum, (including the monitor of that forum, who also, by the way, sat there and wrote posts at me on the open forum using my real name, which I had never told her in the first place, but which she had divined by looking at my e-mail identification) but I am just going to write what I have to say anyway. Many people have responded wonderfully positively to my posts, and I know I benefited from writing them. I may even have some tools now to deal with people's uglier, more ignorant, or more fearful, "food-addict-mindset"-type reactions.
I mention all this because what happened to me on the water forum was devastating, and so overwhelming I could not even react to it at the time it happened. But those people cannot keep me down. The truth will come out, and it will be shown that they are wrong, and that I am right to say that they abused me.
I do not want to focus on my difficulties or sound excessively angry. My only real regret is that I do not dare go on the water forum and just keep on reporting my experience as I was reporting it, so helpfully to myself and others, at the time I was screamingly, hysterically, witch-hunted off that forum. I am just going to rely on this forum to make my reports. I know I am right to do as I do, that is, be honest and be unafraid to really leave behind food addiction -- even though others on the forum may not want m to succeed in fasting and in really getting sober-from-food-addiction.
Well, I have to go pretty soon, and I have only addressed my issues with getting support to fast, and expressing myself on my food addiction sobriety-through-fasting process. But getting support or a least expressing myself to a forum is pretty important, and a large part of fasting, probably. I don't know. I feel confused now. I don't know what is going to bring me success.
I have been pretty successfully making fasts of almost 60 hours. I am trying to start a 60-hour fast right now, but I am feeling half-hearted about it. I am dealing with exhaustion in my life, physically, due to a lack of enough sleep (like all toxic food addicts, i need copious amounts of sleep to function well).
I think my format for posting on this forum will be to report I hope daily on my work to extend my fasts longer and longer, working up to really substantial lengths, which I would then take regularly... fasting 21 days at a stretch 3 times a year, say; with shorter fasts each week and month in between.
I have as I say been fasting on my own and perhaps since I have also been meditating I feel kind of confident in it. I last fasted ending last night -- I was trying to go longer... it was a 38 1/2 hour fast. I started a 60 hour fast this morning but
The one big thing in my life is I have really decided to change my materialistic driven way of being. i am trying to value above all else not achievement but love, and giving to others. "Giving" can also just mean telling others what I really think and feel and want -- taking that risk.
I just feel "hungry" now and as I say really not very convinced of this fast.
I will post tomorrow and maybe write in my fasting blog, too
I really need to find the way to bring myself up and determine to fast, to make fasting fun somehow -- God, how???
The other news of my life is that I have a celebrity crush and fantasize a lot about this person -- lik, every day and night. I know this is par of my materialism and i am just using him. The hardest part about letting go of materialism is STOPPING the habit of trying to use men for some kind of emotional fix. Stopping the dependency attitude. Just not indulging it. Just looking really honestly at this celeb I "love" and saying to myself, as happens to be true: you do not really love him. Since I really do not even like this man that much. I think writing about this emotional neediness will actually help me out of it and help me fast. The more sober my mindset generally the easier it is to fast. So my posts here will be about everything spiritual going on in my life. If you don't like this, quit reading! And keep any nasty, fearful, or "warning" responses to yourself! i am an adult who chooses for herself what to do with her own body, and writes honestly about it. Leave me alone! Got to go, alas. I will keep posting.
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- Re: Fasting Update chrisb1
15 years ago
1,627
Google AdvertisementThis is a reply to # 1,044,014Lauray,
it is disappointing to hear that you have in some way been "ousted" by some members from the Water Fasting Forum: I certainly hope I wasn't one of them.
I thought I hadn't seen you post in a while,and came looking to see how you are getting on with your fasting experiences; which I hope are all good ones with lots of benefits.
I have been looking back at the posts in that forum but can't for the life of me find any abuse or argumentative members who ganged up on you as it were.
Any-hows if you decide to return (which I hope you do), I shall do my utmost in your defence to allow the freedom of posting that anyone else deserves.
chrisb1
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- Re: Fasting Update lauray
15 years ago
1,751
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hey, chrisb,
thanks for your message... I really appreciate your support... yeah, you could not have been aware of everything that went on because the monitor of the forum conducted a private email exchange with me in which she fired a lot of horrible misinformation about fasting at me and told me I was not allowed to post there any more in the way that was effective (and I thought not at all disrespectful) for me... I was just posting these sort of long honest detailed messages and I was healing from them and getting more fasting healing and success... until the day came when some people started getting controlling and taking it out on me because I would say at the top of my posts, "please do not respond to this post" ... this was a careful, considered move on my part... I KNEW from vast experience in groups, therapy, fasting etc. that I NEEDED the experience of just speaking without receiving a response.
You do NOT have to understand or validate this need; I know it is my valid need.
I was just going through a slow process of learning to fast more successfully and I was telling it like it was -- and a lot of people wrote to me expressing thanks for my honesty.
I do NOT think I was out of line in seeking fulfillment of this need (for not receiving reactions) in a support forum. I believe a forum can and should provide this kind of support. I was asking for support in the form of pure "witnessing." This is the appropriate form for me. I am not controlling anyone. People can still violate me and post back. I am just saying what I need and prefer.
But the reaction WAS also there, on the forum; and it was so insane. these people were acting like I was a criminal, or that I had actually silenced them (how?? I cannot control what they do!! They are perfectly free to post even if I say i don't prefer it!!! -- as they themselves demonstrated! That people are unable to make this leap of logic, and then have to slam me around, even "banish" me -- is incredibly frustrating to me. i was really traumatized. I felt I had found a safe place to tell about my process. I felt a real need for the forum. And suddenly I was told I was an outlaw and unacceptable.)
A lot of misinformation and false thinking about fasting was directed my way, which was also traumatic.
I know that the monitor has "edited" the record of this forum... she used to just go in and delete my posts... so it would not surprise me if she had also deleted all evidence of her own and others' nastiness. This may be why you did not see it.
... the result, with the screaming reactions of some members (talking about me in posts to each other, as if I were not present, etc.), and with the monitor's hypervigilance of me... sending me private warning emails every time I posted -- threatening to "banish" me from the forum -- was that I orchestrated, without consciously wanting to, a re-enactment of my trauma of exclusion and of being silenced and censored as I was working out important, vital problems for myself... I was told that my challenges were "unacceptable"... it was all based in the desire of others to control me and reject me. I was effectively silenced and stopped from expressing myself on the forum. I am really upset by this still. I had really made progress in my fasting life by posting to the forum and suddenly I was told that I was not allowed to speak. Not allowed to say the words that were honest and that it was so therapeutic for me to say. And misinformed fearful people deciding I was "in danger" ... what idiocy, in the first place; I from my reading and studies know they are just coming from a place of being controlling; of misinformation; and of food addiction ... still it was traumatic. Please, if you respond to this post, PLEASE do not start with words about "danger" or warnings. Please. I just about can't stand it any more. I really need above all to be trusted as an adult and respected as a human being. Not screamed warnings at. It is just so destructive. I just cannot take any more of that stuff. I really do not know how to deal with others' fearfulness/controlling attitudes.
... I do have a little trouble reading your message to me here since the ganging up was very clear to me and also to many others who wrote to me privately.
Though perhaps you only meant that you wished the forum to welcome me, which I appreciate.
Thanks again for your support,
Lauray- Re: Fasting Update LoveFoodTooMuch
15 years ago
1,606
Google AdvertisementThis is a reply to # 1,046,763Hello Laurey,
I am sorry to hear about all the mean responses you have received. Water Fasting is a complicated thing I am learning (I am still finding out about the best way for me). I do believe that fast can help compulsive overeating. I am experinceing the need to eat less after 2day fast. Still, there is a long way ahead of me. I am afraid of the extreams - either abandoning all restraints or being to put anything else in my mouth because of the fear that it is dirty, processed.....How pure can we get without going crazy? Thank you for posting.
I am still wondering if my small fasts are worth anything (plus I still take prescribed medication:( which I don't think really leanses me - at the same time I don't want to crash compleatly.)
I started to fast with the help of my meds, mowntain dew (yes, it is horrible), then I replaced it with jasmin tea and now - just water.- Re: Fasting Update lauray
15 years ago
1,696
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hey,
Thanks for your response! I do not fear "going crazy" myself: I have decided not to fear it & have become convinced by my reading and experience in fasting that there is really very little to fear. What I think, as regards myself, is that these fears such as the one you mention come to me out of a fear of being without my fix (food) -- not out of any real danger. I speak of course for my own self... I think the body is really to be trusted... I think for myself it is important to maintain this attitude... I only got to where I am by thoroughly exploring and confessing my fears -- and by doing research about them. Which was hard -- I still am reluctant to read mainstream articles on fasting... I have this intuitive knowledge about fasting which gets "beaten up" by (prejudiced, ignorant) scientists and also by people with no perspective & strong opinions... I am learning to recognize these types of people and to defend my own intuition. I get so scared by people sometimes, though... because fasting is so important to me as a kind of basic necessity for my human dignity... as the way out of the humiliation of compulsive overeating.. with all its personality distortions (it's an addiction) and with all its life-compromising, again, humiliating, circumstances.
Yeah, in my own humble opinion, any fast, even a short fast, that one can do, is worthwhile. Even if I screw up afterward. Fasting I feel strengthens my body. I choose to believe this strengthening cannot be undone and is always worth it. I choose to believe that if I really get up the will and "sober-mind" to fast, this is good, and it should always be pursued... again I speak for myself alone. I believe that anxiety is a major hallmark of compulsive overeating -- due to the neurological effect of the intestinal condition sustained by compulsive overeating -- and that a lot of e disturbing, "what-if" thoughts that I get about fasting -- I could give you a long list of thoughts that used really to frighten me and that I have been working on and have really been able to leave behind -- these thoughts area somehow created by the physical condition in the body that triggers the brain condition of anxiety...
I have found I BELIEVE a successful way to lengthen my fasts.
I am completing my first 60-hour fast in 3 years tonight. Yay!!
The way I have achieved this is just by trying again and again for a long time, and in spite of all the screaming negative messages that I got from others
The actual key to my success is that I set a "sobriety date" for myself -- I used to go to a lot of AA to address my compulsive overeating (both secretly, not telling others why I was there, and openly, in some groups where for whatever reason I felt comfortable and felt my addiction would not be dismissed as "different," if not unacceptable... I really wanted, rightly or wrongly, to consider food as exactly the same as any other substance. The people who screamed Oh, but yue neeeeed fuuuuude ta liiiivvveee!!!!! and beat me up that way were really factually mistaken, (a) if you consider the many, many cases of yogis who have lived without eating -- at least for long periods of time -- and theoretically having found a way to transcend food (consider the breatharian movement also) -- not that I feel my food addiction has progressed so far that this is the only solution for me -- just that I really believe it is possible -- but also (b) if you consider the fact or believe the idea that under certain circumstances NO eating is acceptable -- I mean, when your intestinal bacteria are out of whack. Sometimes you just HAVE to fast, or worsen your life-condition... i.e., sometimes the only sober thing to do is fast. At these times, eating for me is what drinking is to an alcoholic. And When my body is NOT in that state, THen and only then is eating acceptable, and only non-triggering food (for me, raw, actually living food [sprouts] -- also for me the living food has to be full-leaved, green, non-starchy living food [sprouts]). ... so sobriety is just as cut and dried for me as it is for an alcoholic... there are, I choose to believe, no circumstances under which I myself with my body would "have to eat" -- have to violate my body's healthy desire to keep its bacteria under control -- in order to stay alive. ... I can have a "bottom line " kind of behavior just like an alcoholic. And it WOULD be possible for me not to eat at all -- to learn that, from people who knew how... so food is NO different, ultimately, from a drug.... I feel writing this that my task in life really may sort of be to evolve into the state of being totally abstinent from food... maybe, gradually.
Anyway, what is important right now is that I have this sobriety date: for a day count of taking living food only and taking fasts of increasing lengths... the rule s that every third fast has got to be LONGER than the fast 3 fasts before it, by a quantity of 6 hours... starting with this 60 hour fast I am now doing. This will really make a difference in my life.
I am on Day 9 of this day count.
My secret is that my Sobriety Date is the birthday of someone I have a from-afar crush on and I am going to live in his area next summer and I will be able to announce in local AA meetings there that I have 6 months, about the time I get there... then I will have 1 year on his birthday... this person is really special to me though I do not know him... I want to get close to him somehow... I am using this incentive to get serious about my life and really make a change that I need to make.. instead of just living intoxicated all the time. And destroying myself. I feel very ashamed & discouraged about how my food addiction has devastated my life. I really have just about no relationships.
And the local AA there -- which I used to belong to (under the "secret" method, unfortunately) -- will support me to keep up the sobriety day count even though I may never get close to this person (yeah, he's a famous person)
But it works for me. It really does. .. AS my fasts get longer I will have to adjust the rule or something.. to make it feasible ... but for now I am going to just get the ability to fast for say a week developed!
My best to you, and please write back,
Love,
Lauray
- Re: Fasting Update chrisb1
15 years ago
1,534
Google AdvertisementThis is a reply to # 1,049,830Lauray,
just like to congratulate you on day 9 of your fast if I read that correctly.
Food addiction (like any other addiction) can be a harrowing and trying experience until it is broken, but sometimes, just sometimes, it is far easier to deal with when you are sharing the same or a similar experience with others as you are with AA.
Most fasting advocates of the past encouraged people needing or wanting to undergo the fasting experience to do so in an atmosphere of encouragement with like-minded individuals: a problem shared is a problem halved as it were. This is why I underwent my first extended fast (by necessity) in the company of other fasters where we could share our experiences and offer encouragement to one another as the days went by: I found this to be invaluable.
A fasting retreat set aside exclusively for patients with all kinds of health-related problems ranging from the serious (me) to the not so serious. I think if I had tried to "go it alone" I probably wouldn't have made it.
I have also been a person prone to deep levels of anxiety with no rational explanation as to WHY: mental confusion, the inability to think things thru, major depression, physical lethargy and mental apathy. I then stumbled across the answer to a very large degree......Natural Hygiene and targeted nutrients for my Brain and Nervous system. Voila......they all but virtually disappeared. However, if I stray from this health-path I have chosen (and need) I resort back to my old ways and into the depths of despair.
Some people (like me) I think have an "unusual susceptibility" to those things that are around us in terms of diet and the other agencies of nature which can and do bring about good health if used properly.
Something to ponder.
Wishing you well
Chris- Re: Fasting Update molten
15 years ago
1,646
This is a reply to # 1,049,886Advertisement
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I agree with Chris wholeheartedly about "sticking to the path." I was 60 pounds overweight and very sick. Had a liver condition that was killing me and suffered from deep depression. I am a writer by trade, and I could ot even write my own name at times. Would spend most of my days alone in my apartment with the phone turned off so nobody would bother me. It was horrible.
I came across fasting in desperation. I tried not to eat for one day and got really ill. The withdrawal was so bad I almost passed out. I went out and ate a cheeseburger and the symptoms all but disappeared. This really intrigued me. Soon I realized how my toxic insides were actually causing these withdrawals. For me it was crucial to walk through the withdrawal and come out the other side. I am so glad I did. Like Chris, I have more energy and vitality today than I did when I was 20. And I just turned 41!
We have to stick together though. Do not give up. Hang in there. After seven to 11 days, the symptoms all but vanish. I recall feeling I could go on fasting indefinately. This is the miracle zone. May it happen for you. Best regards and let us know if we can be of further service and/or support.
Rob J
http://www.fitnessthroughfasting.com
- Re: Fasting Update chrisb1
15 years ago
1,660
This is a reply to # 1,049,943Interesting Website RobJ. I'll have a peruse and let you know what I think.
You will find many fasters on this forum who have extensive knowledge of their subject. In my own case going back for 30 years and more in the true Natural Hygienic tradition.
There are bound to be some healthy differences of opinion but we are all on the same wavelength with the same objectives.
Welcome to Curezone.
I haven't seen you here before.
- Re: Fasting Update chrisb1
15 years ago
1,660
- Re: Fasting Update molten
15 years ago
1,646
- Re: Fasting Update LoveFoodTooMuch
15 years ago
1,698
This is a reply to # 1,049,830Congrats Lauray,
I think the "believe" element is what counts most. Again, tahnk you for sharing. As many here agree, having a supportive envirement has a lot to do with success. Is it not nice to have more control over food after a fast? I find it becomes easier to choose "fresh" food and the withrow symptoms are less. Well, I have not experienced any severe symtoms but...also I have to admit, I am taking my meds(only 2) to stay alive. It either that, or I get myself commited somewhere to be pumed up with even more crap:)))
"Keep comming back!"
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- Re: Fasting Update lauray
15 years ago
1,699
Hulda Clark Cleanses
Wormwood, Clove, Clarkia, Turmeric, Epsom Salt, Uva Ursi, Goldenr...
Google AdvertisementGoogle AdvertisementThis is a reply to # 1,050,463Everyone,
Thanks for your supportive responses. i am touched by the concern and the relating of experiences with Depression (which for me is always so clearly the result of compulsive overeaating)
I wrote the following letter in response to someone who messaged me.
I thought I would start a long fast Sunday, Dec. 10 but will probably start Monday, with everyone else in a group someone on curezone sarted.
My letter below gives my status and strategies on persuading myself to fast for longer periods of time.
I found something sufficiently compelling (too shy to say exactly what) that helped me make certain commitments to myself about lengthening my fasts. The letter below describes the specifics of my self-commitments to longer fasting periods.
This fast will be at least 66 hours.
But I have had the idea to fast 25 days. Just to do it. i know I can.
The trouble is, I cannot set my mind to staarting today if I have given myself permission to start tomorrow.
But I did have really positive energy about starting today, and making it a really long fast.
I am quite discouraged about my inability to detach from my drug, food.
Zen teacher says to think: "these are only thoughts... who am I REALLY?", in other words, as I interpret it for my fasting, I CAN stand to fast... the negative thoughts that say that I HAVE to get high as long as I am "allowed" to are ONLY THOUGHTS. And who am I really? I am someone who can fast and become well.
Hi!
It is great to get a response. i wrote some more on my profile but didn't realize the space limit. It's Sunday and I have started -- I guess. I SO hate not to be completely positive and committed but HAVE to be honest... that is one thing I know... it really helps if I am 100% honest with others about where I am at. Here is the thing: I recently made a commitment to having raw, "living" foods only -- i.e., sprouts... this just works best for me... and I have kept this commitment. Since Nov. 18 I have had living, raw foods only. Concurrently with this I have to have a fasting program, if I want to be well. So: I made a commitment to particular rules for myself for fasting. I cannot not fast. i must, must really get on a regular fasting program and increase the lengths of my fasts... there may come a time in my life when I am stable and detoxed and need to fast less, but this is what I need for right now. So: my rules for fasting that I have set for myself are, I think, very feasible, and I have kept them so far. They are: that I have to be fasting at least once in any one-week period, i.e., I can have a max. of only 7 non-fasting days between fasts (as I say, I seem to be able to do only short fasts right now, though I have fasted once per week for several years... it is lengthening the fasts to the point where they are truly therapeutic and really make a diference that I have had trouble with. i really suffer [depression, brain fog, lethargy] and these symptoms all totally vanish with fasting 3 days or longer and so I NEED to start doing these longer fasts!!!!.... ) .... OK, sorry for complicated message. So, I can only have a max. of 7 days between fasts; and -- second rule/commitment -- every third fast that I take has got to be a "long fast," i.e., 60 hours or more; and every third fast has got to be 6 hours longer than the last "long fast." I achieved a fast of 60 hours a little while ago. Probably 2 weeks ago or longer :( ... It seems, however, that setting these rules has to some extent, at least in the beginning, made me fast less. :( The program is a little too easy. i feel as though I would have achieved a 66-hour fast by now WITHOUT the commitment to the rules I set for myself. But I am afraid to set a more strenuous program, because I know myself and know I will just get discouraged and it will be REALLY hard to convince myself to pick myself up again if I fail. But it is so hard to take a "long" fast when the "rules" or the commitments I have made to myseld do not REQUIRE me to take a "long" fast! Even though my body VERY clearly needs to fast a long time, I am discouraged by the idea that "well, if I fast a long time NOW, I will just have to fast a long time AGAIN, within a week, to keep my commitment." The commitment is VERY important to me. It really helps me to have it. So -- long story short -- it is hard for me to begin a long fast Sunday, today, because this would only be my second fast since my last long fast -- not my third fat -- not the fast that I am required to make a "long" fast, in this case, 66 hours. Not being REQUIRED to fast even 66 hours (required by my own commitment, that is), I find it EXTREMELY hard to feel at all motivated to fast the 66 hours (or longer, as I would of course love to do). ... I guess the thing I could do is revise my commitment so that if I fast a long fast "early," before I need to, -- say, if I fast a long fast on the SECOND as opposed to the third fast after my last long fast -- I do not have to fast a long fast again on the third fast after the long fast... I can wait 3 fasts before a long fast, again. But I still do not know whether this will actually get me to fast a long fast before I actually HAVE to, according to my own "rules." I feel so discouraged -- as though I have totally slowed myself down, and destroyed my own motivation, and given myself new excuses not to get detoxed... Ugh. ... You may think these rules are odd, but they are the best method for me. I have been struggling for years to achieve longer fasts... I know I do well with feasible commitments, and with keeping track of the time i have kept them, like an alcoholic counts his sober days in AA. I have studied my own fasting patterns, and i developed these "rules" or this program for fasting based on my own patterns. I found it would usually take me 3 "tries" to fast a long fast. Well, anyway, long message. The good news is I am totally committed to my "new rules" and fast-lengthening program, so if I fail to fast longer than 24 hours or so today, I will definitely keep the long fast MOnday, assuming I start then. Eventually the time will come when I am REQUIRED by the rules to fast the 66 hours, and I will do it then. A fast is anything longer than 24 hours: if I fast 24 hours, it's a fast, and it counts, and I have to consider it in my program. This fast may be a short fast, but I am willing to actually go longer than 24 hours, and let it count as a fast, so that my next fast (required to take place within 7 days of this fast) will be REQUIRED to be 66 hours. I am showing a little willingness, you see, in that I am letting this short fast actually be a "must-count-as-a-fast" fast, instead of intentionally breaking it before 24 hours have elapsed,and thereby "buying time" before I become "required" to take the 66-hour fast. ...
Again, I am sorry for all the detail.
I think in writing all this out I am just reafirming it for myself, reaffirming my commitment to my "new rules," which are, despite my taking advantage of them quite a bit, are still really working for me. This 60-hour fast I just took is the longest I have fasted in 3 plus years. That's success!
I think I just feel the need, also, for self-disclosure and support. ... another thing I was going to mention I forgot, but... I shared the fact that I fasted with a teacher today at my Zen center. This went over not that well... so I need people who really support fasting. This is another reason I am glad to hear from you. Thanks very, very much, again, for writing. I may "post" this letter so I can share with all.
Best wishes to you, too,
Laura
- Re: Fasting Update lauray
15 years ago
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- Re: Fasting Update chrisb1
15 years ago
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- Re: Fasting Update lauray
15 years ago
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- Re: Fasting Update LoveFoodTooMuch
15 years ago
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- Re: Fasting Update lauray
15 years ago
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- Re: Fasting Update chrisb1
15 years ago
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