I married into a narcissistic family, and it has been a nightmare and the worst experience of my life. 7 years later, I’ve distanced myself from them, and that is all you can do, but the damage they have done to our marriage has affected us in so many ways that our relationship will never be 100%, but we make it work. It’s been a long struggle, and much counseling to make my husband realize things about his family that he never realized before. ... ... I’ve heard of narcissism, knew (or thought I knew) what it meant, but never understood the true meaning of the word until I met them and have ha ... [This message is long. Retrieve the whole message]
Domino, I didn't read your entire post, but I "get it" about this family. Because I didn't read the entire post, I'm unclear as to whether or not this "family" is cohabitating in this run-down house that you were pressured into buying, or if there are children as a result of your marriage.
I can't (and, won't) tell you what to do - you've engaged in counseling to save your marriage, but this marriage is doomed, regardless of how much counseling you've engaged in with your husband. He is allowing this abuse, and you clearly have a choice before you: stay and manage this misery until such time as your husband (and/or his family) calls it quits, or get the hell out and recover from these experiences before you get involved in an extramarital affair or choose another narcissist. That's it.
If there are children as a result of this marriage, you have my most heartfelt pity because those children will (without fail) be raised to become perfect narcissists, themselves, or perfect victims.
From my personal experiences, my own past issues (from early childhood, on) are directly related to the sociopaths that I ended up marrying during the past 30 years. The first one was abusive on every level, and the second one was a seemingly benign predator that married me for my money and maintained a deviant, violent sexua| "double-life" that was exposed over a year ago. The financial frauds that the second exspath included coercion, forgeries, and raiding of my private investments. Because I did not understand myself, first, I did not understand the set up and long-con of this second exspath which has resulted in life being utterly destroyed. Financially, spiritually, sexually, emotionally, and physically, I was left completely dismantled.
Having typed that, this whole-self devastation has resulted in my determination to learn from these experiences and to educate others about what sociopathy is, who a sociopath might be, and how to protect one's Self (Self = soul) from experiencing the same devastation that I have. This is my opportunity to learn about boundaries and construct them. This is also my opportunity to recognize that I do not (do not) have to tolerate anyone's "bad behaviors" because I crave approval and acceptance. I am learning to validate myself so that I can choose whether or not to "trust" another human being. I do not "feel" obligated to tolerate any type of behavior that I find inappropriate, distasteful, dishonest, or harmful to me or others. Although I'm recovering and I'll be okay, in due time, I would not wish my experiences upon another human being, even the predatory exspath that destroyed my life.
The family dynamics of your husband echoes that of the second predatory exspath, and these dynamics will never, ever, EVER change. Certainly, there is an "environmental" influence, but there are also questions about the role that genetics plays in sociopathic tendencies. Some of the behaviors and actions that you're describing are hard-core sociopathic tendencies, and there is no "safe" or "successful" method of managing these tendencies. Sociopathy cannot be medicated, surgically removed, counseled away, or spiritually zapped. It is a lifelong and terminal disorder that results in damages, across the boards.
Visit the following website to learn more about sociopathy and recovery: www.lovefraud.com
I wish you the very best.
EDIT ADD: Domino, I went back and read over your post and it seems that you did not produce children within this marriage. A very wise decision. But, what I also am reading is that you believe that the marriage is "strong" and that you will "make it work." I would urge you to visit the website that I posted, above, and learn more about your situation. The marriage isn't "strong," by any stretch of the imagination, and the only thing that seems to be "working" in overdrive is the blatant abuse that you're enduring and tolerating to please the husband and his family.
There are very few things in this lifetime that are a certainty. But, what is vital for you to accept is that, the more years that go by, the more damages you will suffer regardless of whom is perpetrating the damages. The family dynamics that you're describing are almost carbon-copied of the ones that I experienced with the second exspath, and these people (and, their son) are never, ever going to change.
Ur husbands family are grandiose npd. Reading ur story i can see u r a strong woman. I m so happy for u that ur husband was not a npd himself n he was willing to get jelp. I have never shared my story n i am still not free... I wld like to share my story in hopes that it may help someone else. I m 56 and i have been dealing with this cruel, pathological nothing for 38 yrs. I will have to finish my story at a later date. I have to run out. But God Bless U.
Why would my beautiful daughter Marry a man like this ... And then go on to have three kids he is a narcissist sociopaths he devoured my daughter self-esteem and He is now moved on and doing it to his children she's left him and is living here with us my husband And I but there has been so much damage to these kids already I don't know how to deal with my grandkids anymore ! When I used to go to my daughters house to help and visit I was more like the happy go lucky grandma who played with them but now that they are living here I understand what my daughter was trying to tell me that the minute I leave they all start acting bad and I can only associate it with the way my son in law treats my daughter I front of them they have no respect for her because of him and no that she is not there to monitor what goes on at his house when he had the kids it's really difficult to understand why the come back so different ! This morning he was supposed to pick the kids up at 12 normally he's late we asked if we could have them a 1:3 more to take them out for beackfast of course he made it a huge issue on the phone but we took the kids out anyway cause technically he could have six but my daughter dor t want any trouble ! Well he came storming into the restaurant and pointed his finger at the kids and said you guys have 10 min you hear! They all stopped eating with Such terror on there faces all of them Look scared this broke my heart they are small to deal with this 8,7,5 the 5 yr old girl is taking it the worst ! I don't know what I can do to help my daughter and here kids ?
You just described the hell I am going through like a fly on the wall. My situation isn't nearly as bad only because we haven't married. One reason is he's in a divorce currently with also a narc.( I'll use this abbreviation) when referring to the toxic people. I had no idea what in Gods name was so wrong with this " family" until I stumbled onto a Dr.Phil show this summer. Its like a light went on. A light house sized light. I am actually better at dealing with it all since I at least know what the hell is up with them. It helps very much to just read about the traits and reasons. I'm a digger for knowledge. Id rather know the truth than a pretty painted version which is the complete opposite of a narc. The "sweep it under the carpet"doesn't fly with me. The ordeal began the first day I met his family. The day
they bombarded us like a reunion. It has been my understanding to run for my life. Staying neutral at all cost. Unfortunately I hide more than I run. Running only gives them further fuel. I don't like using the word " hate", but it evokes hatred when I am near or hear anything about his ex or his family. Including his narc kids. I'm in limbo of what to do. Questioning if I should end this relationship altogether. How long will I be able to stand it. Even knowing how these cult members are competes against my wits and what I should do about my relationship with him. Thank you for helping by sharing your horror.
I'm sorry that you are experiencing the drama\trauma of a dysfunctional family dynamic. But, I will make a suggestion that getting out before you enter the legal and binding contract of marriage would be a very prudent consideration.
The first problem is that this guy is not yet divorced and the drama and trauma of the proceedings can actually BIND you to, and WITH someone that may be toxic to you. It's a very recognized condition called "trauma bond" by professionals.
I speak on this from 30 years of experiences with 2 vastly different ex spouses that were disordered. The longer we remain with these people, the more is at stake to lose. And, the most priceless loss of all is our own self esteem and self value.
Read my Curezone blog, "Coping With Betrayal," and accept that it is far better to be "alone" than to be reduced to rubble by another human being.
Marriage is a legal contract and a license to marry costs nothing compared to the trauma of a toxic or abusive relationship and the drama of a bitter divorce. Don't walk away ~ RUN!
I actually thought I might have wrote this myself. I actually checked to see if I did and forgot!
I used to feel the same way about NC. I was about a day away from demanding it, they disowned us, that includes my husband and our children, Their grandchildren.
What is sad, is when I look back, the day we were disowned was the happiest day of my life and I have children!
Do not ever EVER feel guilty for going NC. It is the only way to stop this.Stay Strong!
WOW. First I want to say thank you for taking the time to write your experience. It really helps those of us trying to make sense of very similar family dynamics. Your story was so similar to mine that it was scary.
I think the thing that people do not understand is how these people totally try and destroy your self image.
I came from an abusive childhood. My mother was very abusive when I was young. I feel in some ways it made me strong. I feel very intensely other people's pain and problems and I find that I am good at helping people. I am however too loyal, WAY too generous and sensitive and I have no idea who I am as a person. I was a prime target for this family.
My husband has many of the same issues that those who survive narcissists have. Low self esteem, can not make decisions save his soul, can not communicate well, immaturity. We saved each other, I believe, and are truly soul mates. My mother never turned on him. She was very satisfied to turn on me. So he was lucky. His parents and one sister has made my life a living hell from day one. However it has taken me almost 30 years (I met him when I was 16) to finally find myself and realize that I am not the bad person they say I am and it is THEIR problem. It still hurts and I am finding it hard to stand up for myself. They will never admit anything and it is always your problem if you stand up. They can say what ever they want about you but if you stand up they act like you are the living devil. This is what you have to realize about these narcs.
The passive aggressive behavior is the huge tip-off for avoiding these people from the beginning. You can have a wonderful relationship with a person from this background but know from the beginning that it will be hard and the most frustrating thing in your life. These Narcs reel you in with niceness and offer gifts, give you money, say wonderful things in front of your spouse but then the moment you leave the room you are viciously attacked. My husband still had a hard time believing that his parents and his one sister would say such things about me. Even when others confirm he still only saw how they fawned over me when he is around. I would suggest getting a very small tape recorder and leaving it in your purse to capture what they say when you and your spouse leave the room. Mine revealed to him some pretty horrific things and how they wished they could hire a hit man to get rid of me, I was a bad mother, bad wife, a stupid bimbo, how they wished they could replace me with this woman or that woman, etc. etc. All at the same time they lavished me with Christmas gifts. Said what an amazing cook I was, How pretty I was. Gave us a beautiful card with money in it for our anniversary saying how we were the prefect couple. It is these types of things that make you feel like you are going crazy. It is always two complete opposites. What they project to your spouse and what they project to everyone else or to you in private. When my father died they said horrible things to me in private but denied it when I told my husband and he confronted them. They find an excuse almost every single year to ban my birthday and give me the silent treatment. Everything I say and do are taken and twisted into something totally different and always bad.
The thing that is most puzzling to me is that his mother is paranoid beyond words. Is this a trait as well or what? If we go on vacation by ourselves she calls endlessly and seems extremely stressed and panicked like my husband is going to die or something. When we went to my family reunion she almost had a nervous breakdown. She acted like my family was going to kill him and dump him in the river. My family adores my husband and we have a strong and very loving relationship. It is this "craziness" that you constantly deal with. It seems normal to your partner because they grew up with this and it is presented to them that they just worry about them and LOVE them so much.
The problem is that it sticks with you even when they are not around and this is the part that you must control. I started to feel like perhaps they were right, I was crazy! I was a bad mother and bad wife, a stupid looser. THIS is their tool of destruction, getting inside of your head. They get great pleasure out of trying to tear you down to a sub-human. You MUST see them for what they really are to heal from them. They are pathetic, sad and very lonely people. DO NOT give them sympathy because they will use it against you. DO NOT think you can talk to them or include them in your life. They will turn everything you do or say around. DO NOT express your hopes and dreams or personal feelings. They LOVE to use these against you. You can not reason nor ever be accepted by them. The best you can hope for is that your spouse will choose you and stand up for you and distance you from them. My husband says now to only talk "Fluff" to them and think of it as a small moment of time. This helps.
They are very very unhappy people. Sometimes I get scared of them because his mother and his father have threatened me and the "hit man" comment so I do stand on guard with them and make it perfectly clear that if they ever threaten me again that my family will take it into their hands. Get your family to back you. The one thing I have learned is that they are cowards face to face and because they are so paranoid you can at least back them off with face to face confrontation, specially with a group of family or friends at your back.
God bless to all who have to deal with these people. They are frauds and completely emotionally void humans. The tell tail comment that I hold dear to my sanity is when my Mother-in-law told everyone how she "HATES when I always say I love things." I love your dress, I love this turkey, I love the day, the snow, etc. etc. Even though she says she loves things all the time somehow my love of life absolutely kills her. They are huge HATERS and they specially hate people who love life and are happy. It mirrors to them how pathetic and unhappy they really are.
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I married into a family with narcissists also. And they all attend church faithfully, unless they want to be vindictive towards the pastor, at which point they will try to cancel services. So I understand what you are saying.
This is my family too. I divorced after a 24 year marriage and it was like a chocalite morsel to the deprived. They loved adding to my pain and stirring up drama. I actually moved away and for my own healing, stayed away from all of them. Of course, they made up all sorts of juicy reasons why (none true). It took several years to see from a distance how much stress they added to my life. All mine are "good church going southern baptists" ..... My faith is me and my Bible, a group of ladies I study with, a few Christian radio programs and that's all. Still healing from the damage of my narcissistic family.
I have just left my boyfriend of 3 full years and my best friend of 5 or 6 and reading this post has been a flashback into the incredible pain and abuse I felt during that time in my life. I am struggling to stay away because I truly, with all my heart, fell in love with their son. It took me this long to realize that he cannot have more than a superficial relationship because of almost 30 years of mental abuse and although I pity him and his inability to separate himself from his family, I can no longer subject myself to this.
For so long, he could not even recognize or admit to himself that his parents truly hated me. They manipulated him into believing I was crazy--to the point where I began to believe it myself. I have PTSD and I struggle to have confidence in my own decisions and judgements.
I know I cannot go back. But the loss of a best friend and real love in my life has been harder to bear than I ever imagined. I keep telling myself that I have made the happier decision for the rest of my life and that doors are now open to me that would have been shut forever. I struggle to imagine life without a man who made me laugh and my heart skip a beat. But then I remember that this same man was willing to subject me to this same abuse, knowing that it existed and knowing what it would do to me. I do not believe anyone deserves a lifetime of that. I think he recognized that, in the end, he is incapable of giving me the love I truly deserve--the damage his team of narcissistic parents have inflicted upon him have rendered him so. Because he cannot leave and in his heart is too far gone, he had to let me go.
I hope that anyone in the situation like mine or in the above one will see these posts and find the courage within themselves to get out. Run. There is nothing you can do. Be willing to break your own heart in order to save your mind, your body and your soul.
My husband and I have been married for a year and 6 months and it's been the most awful experience in my life with my MIL, her immediate family knows exactly how she is but like everything I've read so far, no they can't change her. My husband has spoken nicely to cussing and yelling, when he does cuss and yell she'll ask him why he's talking to her that way, he responds because you are not listening and understanding only hearing me. She does very nice things for you then uses it against you. She moves everything in our home from where I had it. The biggest problem besides touching thing's is, she took control over my stepson after his parents divorced and he was 9 years old then and now he's 16 years old. She still has a "diaper" on him and he doesn't listen to his dad or me. I'm thankful my husband see's it clearly with her but her actions are going to cause problems for our marriage soon, I want so very bad to speak up to her but I know it won't change anything. We have camera's outside of our house and I constantly look at them, not because I'm afraid of someone breaking in but dreading if she pulls up in the driveway. I told my husband something has got to stop or I'm leaving and he doesn't deserve this. She has cancer and won't even let my FIL tell us the truth and I almost don't care anymore because of how she's made me feel. She showed up 3 day's ago without notice like always but this time it really got to me, she bought my 16 year old stepson a treadmill so he can lose weight, she put it in his bedroom, I am yet to understand that one, he's addicted to video games to the point that no one sees him unless he's hungry and runs to my in laws to eat then back to his room with the door shut I cook every single day without fail. He needs to get out of the house with his friends and exercise like a normal person. I'm fed up and have no say so in our home. My husband is at the end of his rope too, I want to save my marriage but don't know how at this point. There's alot more but I don't have time to type it right now.
Its sounds as if there are a number of toxic dynamics going on in this "family," from the MIL to the husband and on to the step-son. There is absolutely nothing that you can do to "save" this marriage. You can only "save" yourself. If, by chance, your own personal changes promote positive effects upon the relationships, then that's terrific and the marriage may become healthier, in due time. However, from what you typed, there is a reason that the first marriage ended in divorce, and probably not because of what your husband has told you. The dynamics of this family sound abusive, on every level. There is clearly an absence of boundaries, on every level. From the MIL to the stepson, it's no-holds-barred as far as inappropriate behaviors go.
I would gently suggest that you consider the option of individual counseling to learn techniques to manage this toxic environment as far as you are concerned. I would also contemplate the possibility of taking immediate actions to prevent further trampling of boundaries.
For instance, at 16, the stepson should be out working at a part-time job, preparing for college, engaging in extracurricular activities, and so forth. That he is addicted to video games is 100% the fault of his parents - video games, television, DVD's have ALL replaced healthy family interactions as a means of babysitting and managing children, today. If they're quiet and not causing problems, whatever they're doing on their computers doesn't matter in many, many families. This kid is going to be a burden if he isn't forced into some sort of "normal" pattern of behaviors. Is the stepson taking Ritalin or Adderal? Those drugs are other means of management to alleviate parents from taking a role in raising their offspring: if they're quiet, we don't care HOW that quiet is facilitated. Setting boundaries without saying, "These are your boundaries," will be difficult, at first, and absolutely cause problems, but the internet, cell phones, and all technological devices need to be EARNED. Kid wants internet? Then, he can darn well take out trash, mow the lawn, do the dishes, and begin changing his language BEFORE the internet is restored. Password protect the WiFi. Disconnect and store all video consoles away until they've been earned. TEACH this kid about rewards and consequences.
MIL is a different story. If she arrives unannounced, nobody answers the door. If she continues creating a scene, call the police and have her escorted from the property. Post a "NO TRESPASSING" sign on the porch at eye level so that there can be no questions. This woman has to earn the privilege of coming to your home.
This MIL is not going to change. The spouse is not going to change her. So, the choices are that you can remain in this environment and do nothing until you lose your mind. Or, you can remain in this environment and engage in individual counseling to learn positive steps that you can make to help yourself cope. Or, you can contemplate ending this contract of marriage. At any turn, none of the options are pleasant (as is often the case). So, whenever you have some moments of calm, quiet, and balance, it would be a good idea to contemplate these choices, write down your personal goals, and imagine (NOT PREDICT) what your life will be like 5 years from now, and then 10 years from now.
Also, please, consider the extreme levels of anxiety that you're experiencing within this whole family dynamic. Anxiety can cause dreadful physical, spiritual, and emotional issues, and this is why I suggest counseling - a trained professional can give you the tools that you need to cope and manage your situation.
Brightest blessings to you on this challenging journey.
Domino, I can't begin to describe how empowering and liberating it was for me to stumble up on this website and specifically your post. This was five years ago. How are things now? I too married into a Narc family and Dear God it's been hell for the past 11+ years of our marriage. It would be so helpful for me to learn more about your journey since distancing yourself and setting very necessary and healthy boundaries. I did the same--refuse to spend wknd or holidays with my husband's family about 5 yrs ago and it went over like a lead ballon. It's bad. There have been two failed marriages as a result and both my husband and his brother are on their second marriages bc women who marry in do not survive. the last two fought--they did. This system is designed to not break and it's such a well-oiled machine. I have stood up for myself after having sold my soul to them for fear of being isolated and no matter what, I still never knew if I was 'in'. Boy do you know when you're out! So much more to add but need to run. Thank you and thank every other brave soul who posted to this forum. We're victims and in different places in our journey. I'm not alone ---just need to remember that! Please send an update. Thank you!
15 years ago I was emotionally victimized by a sociopath/narcissist after what I originally thought was a romantic relationship. It was a truly horrible experience, but I eventually healed and moved on with my life.
But every few years he resurfaces in hopes of reeling me in again. Emails, phone calls. I've never picked up the phone or answered the emails but it stirs up my trauma all over again and takes weeks or months for it to subside.
I've moved away and have a new unlisted number, but due to my career I am very visible on social media and the internet. He is impossible to block with a variety of emails.
He is back again, trying to connect with me on facebook, linkedin and email. And I am a wreck. My question - do I continue to ignore him and know that he will do the same think down the road, over and over, and I will continue to be traumatized? Or is there some way I can respond whereby he will finally give up? The thought of dealing with this for the rest of my life leaves me terrified.
......he wins. And, that's all that this fellow is interested in: winning.
If you are experiencing extreme anxiety from this, it might be a very good option to consider some counseling therapy just to help you get your bearings straight, and to learn coping and management techniques. Once your confidence increases as you gain management of this anxiety and fear, you response (or, non-resopnse) will be comfortable and he won't matter.
For now, ANY response will be giving him what he wants. I read that you're unable to block all of his emails, and that is truly a shame. But, you can ignore his attempts to contact you, on every level. Don't even read them - I know it's a challenge to simply delete them, but once you do it a few times, that will become easier and easier to do.
I am SO sorry that you're experiencing this and, please, understand that your reaction to this is very typical for those of us who have experienced trauma, particularly when it is the individual who caused the trauma that's trying to get back in.
Brightest blessings of courage and comfort to you.
Hello. I'm in a desperate situation, married since 6 years with 2 children ( 8 m and 3 y). The life with my husband is at the moment a living hell. I want to divorce him but I can't because of financial reason( he is the provider and I'm a home staying mom) and because I'm afraid I will loose my children duo his lies and manipulation. I'm also in his country with few friends but no family. His family support him and believe all the lies he is telling them. His parents even have pushed me away in our apartment a few days ago, while having my daughter in the arms. I can't tell nobody about this as I have no prove and nobody would believe me the nice old people could be capable of such things.
Anyways, after reading more about narcissist condition I do find my husband fiting into this personality : all he cares is to win, he belittled me, treat me like a sclave, try to alienate our daughter against me, have no remorse, no shame, no quilt, he cheated I supposed many times although I didn't catch him exactly cheating but I found messages, sex forums, secretaries, teen p 0 r n,he tried to have affairs with 3 secretaries but each time he denied and told me I'm crazy and paranoia. I suppose he have an affair or flirt with one of his secretary at the moment as the together living had started to drastically degraded since January when she came in his office. Since then the life is a roller coaster with ups and downs. 2 weeks ago died my father and I traveled to prepare his funeral witch was a totally disaster. He told me I'm only stress for him, accused me of having abandoned my children and went to bury a man is already dead since 3 months ( he was in vegetative state for 3 months). From the moment I left the house to drive to airport he called me once letting me hear how my baby cries and he didn't want to pick up the phone 2 days while I was abroad. I manage to speak with him only throw my cleaning lady and that was it, no answer, I didn't know nothing of my children, I got the totally silent treatment like each time something is not in his convenience. I was so upset that I come back and didn't attend the funeral. At home was a disaster. He told my daughter I'm a bad mom for having abandoned her and her brother, he told the same to his parents, that I did not organized nothing and left after half hour I found my father died ( of course was a lie, I asked if I should take the children although he never allowed me to travel with them visiting my parents and country( not alone not with them), I asked him if the babysitter should come, I told him she will anyway come the next day and he shouted and declined everything. Then he lied to his parents that I abandoned them, that I didn't call and many more.
He lately treat me like a sclave that must take care of house, children... I can't go out half an hour because he calls and shout to come back and take care of children because they cry.
My dilemma regarding if he suffer or not from narcissist disorder is because he loves the children, doesn't treat them ugly but he doesn't like to do much with them. He speak lovely and make things only a few minutes and while lying in bed, NEVER outside bed. Ignores them if they want something from him while he is busy ( writing on Facebook most of the time offending EVERYONE does not agree with him, playing on computer, smocking). He makes things with them as long as it fits his wishes. He won't most of the time go to buy breakfast if they are hungry , won't bring our daughter to kindergarten if he has no appointment in the office at 9-10 am ( he wanted to let her home because he doesn't want his daughter telling him when he must wake up and go to work...). He would even ignore or don't want to hold them in the arms when he is offering me the silent treatment ( I suppose because he want to punish me having to do EVERYTHING alone). BUT, he is not ugly verbally with them. What do you think?
I'm so desperate, stressed and I really make an effort to stay sane because my children need me.
I apologize for my bad English, but is not my language.
You are living in an abusive relationship and your children are learning how to be abusive by watching the interactions between you and their father.
White Shark is spot-on. Get out, regardless of money. Money will not ever buy this man a conscience, nor will it ever buy you and your children safety. There are agencies and organizations that will help you and your children to get on your feet.
Additionally, avoid ALL relationships for a couple of years after you've been legally divorced. Get involved in some counseling therapy to learn how to make strong choices for yourself and your children.
I lost everything that I owned and ended up homeless, very, very sick, and without any means of income when I ended my second marriage. I learned that the ex spouse had raided my private investments and that I would never recover a dime from him. I have lived in poverty ever since. BUT..........I am not afraid, I don't have to beg anyone else for my needs to be met, and I am well on my healing path after intensive therapy and the hard work to get there. You (and, anyone else) can do this, too. Don't allow money and / or security to be the reason to remain in an abusive environment. NOTHING is worth that.......your children will either develop into perfect victims, themselves, or abusers like their father. If they see that you make wise decisions and are willing to sacrifice material things in order to preserve your health and theirs, it will make an impact upon them - that women aren't objects to be used or abused.
Then......there's the very distinct possibility that he will eventually be arrested and charged with some type of sex crime. So, get rid of him, now, before he takes you and your children down the toilette with him.
Once again, the "holiday season" is upon us and abusers have available countless opportunities and excuses to perpetrate more frequent and severe episodes of domestic violence and abuse against their victims. Domestic violence/abuse includes: emotional violence, verbal violence, physical violence, religious/spiritual abuse, financial abuse, and sexual abuse. Domestic violence and abuse has no cultural, religious, sexua| orientation, ethnic, or economic boundaries. There is no stereotype or profile for domestic violence to exist, and it covers every "intimate" relationship, including platonic and familial associations.
During the holiday season, it is a statistical fact that reports of domestic violence and the severity of the episodes make a dramatic spike. The reason is simple: there are ample excuses for the abuser to experience "stress," and therefore more ample opportunities to blame victims for increasing stress in one way or another, especially in our current economic climate. Of course, the victims have nothing to do with the perpetration of violence by their abusers - they don't "ask for it," or stretch the limits of stress to cause their abusers to harm them. They are just there, for whatever reason.
If children are involved, the violence often becomes even more extreme with a reported 90% of all domestic violence being perpetrated IN FRONT OF CHILDREN. Often, the victim is threatened with "No Presents" for children unless the victim agrees OR submits to (fill in the blank). The victim is frightened of being abused, certainly, but they are even more frightened of the threats that may be seen through by the abuser. In my previous life, the abuser did, indeed, follow through with threats and the children were denied gifts during the holiday, special holiday meals, participation in religious/spiritual rituals, and many, many other witholdings. Keep in mind this statistical fact: children who are raised in an environment of domestic violence and abuse are 10 times more likely to develop into abusers or victims, themselves. If they develop into abusers, their level of abuse will be greater than their predecessor's.
How to know if you (or, someone you know) is involved in an abusive relationship? The first thing to do is to open your eyes and put on your "listening ears." From the National Domestic Violence Hotline website, www.ndvh.org, a general list of potential violence/abuse is provided:
Calls you names, insults you or continually criticizes you.
Does not trust you and acts jealous or possessive.
Tries to isolate you from family or friends.
Monitors where you go, who you call and who you spend time with.
Does not want you to work.
Controls finances or refuses to share money.
Punishes you by withholding affection.
Expects you to ask permission.
Threatens to hurt you, the children, your family or your pets.
Humiliates you in any way.
You may be in a physically abusive relationship if your partner has ever:
Trapped you in your home or kept you from leaving.
Prevented you from calling police or seeking medical attention.
Hurt your children.
Used physical force in sexua| situations.
You may be in a sexually abusive relationship if your partner:
Views women as objects and believes in rigid gender roles.
Accuses you of cheating or is often jealous of your outside relationships.
Wants you to dress in a sexua| way.
Insults you in sexua| ways or calls you sexua| names.
Has ever forced or manipulated you into to having sex or performing sexua| acts.
Held you down during sex.
Demanded sex when you were sick, tired or after beating you.
Hurt you with weapons or objects during sex.
Involved other people in sexua| activities with you.
Ignored your feelings regarding sex.
I got out. I lost many, many things, including my own children. You, on the other hand, might be able to fare better than I did if you go through the proper channels. NOTHING is worth remaining - "Things" can be replaced, but there is no monetary equivalent to human life or well-being.
My most sincere positive energies and brightest blessings to all who are afraid, suffering, and desperate. End the cycle and contact: .National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1−800−799−SAFE (7233) or TTY 1−800−787−3224
Right. I feel that I "know" that there is something seriously wrong, but I'd like feedback and insight just to affirm my intuition, on this.
My eldest son has tried to make a turnaround, but he's still Borderline, and always will be. After his second marriage ended, he immediately hooked up with a young woman from Russia, online. He claims that they met on a political chat board, but I don't believe that any more than the moon is made of green cheese. Regardless, he went to Moscow on 3 occasions to hook up with this woman and finally brought her over to marry her.
On his dime, he transported her over here, has paid for her naturalization process, married her, etc. Now, she's in her 8th month of pregnancy, which was a "surprise" to my son, and she is behaving badly, IMHO.
It began when I met my son, last year, and he and I had a long, long talk about the past, and the present. When I met his Russian wife, I asked her many questions that were appropriate - I am the elder, here, and I asked questions about her plans, her goals, her homeland, etc., and she later complained that I had asked "awkward" questions.
Since she became pregnant, I had offered to help them both out when the baby was born, and the offer has been rejected, numerous times. "You don't need to help. We have a neighbor who will help." Then, I sent a birthday gift to this woman and she sent the gift back because they weren't skin-tight garments that she's accustomed to wearing - I thought that she'd want to be comfortable during the summer months of her preganancy, as anyone would, and this was not the case.
THEN, I sent baby clothing that I had found and received a message from her that, while she appreciated the clothes, they had enough and they wouldn't be using any baby clothes that were used, unless they "knew the baby that had worn them." They would not be accepting clothing that was "worn too much" or unwashed, unclean, etc., and that they would only be using new cloth diapers.
Whatever - I'd already accepted the fact that I will not be involved in my grandchild's life, and I'm not going to go screaming about grandparents' rights. It's a waste of time, money, energy, and emotions, and I cannot change this situation.
My concern is that this woman has scammed my son for a green card and citizenship in this country. He has paid for all phases of the naturalization processes, including trips to locations and the fees that accompany all of the paperwork. AND........this woman contacted me 2 years ago to complain of my son's abusive behaviors on both FaceBook and through her private Skype account. I believe that she's setting him up for a domestic violence / abuse complaint that will automatically guarantee her a green card, housing, welfare, and every other service to become a citizen, once the baby is born.
During these complaints over FB and Skype, she asked about previous relationships and my son's anger issues, to which I was open and honest about and suggested that she contact the Domestic Violence Hotline. She contacted my younger son in this very same manner at the same time, as well - I didn't know this until last night, and my younger son didn't know about her contacting me, either.
Any insights on this? I'm managing my concerns about this situation, but there is something very wrong with this whole situation, I can see it, I can smell it, and I can almost predict what's going to happen simply because of this woman's odd behaviors, etc. This is NOT a cultural misunderstanding as I know many, many immigrants who do not behave this way, and I have never had a gift given back to me or thoroughly criticized by anyone during my entire lifetime.
To clarify: after the woman had contacte my younger son, and myself, she deleted both her FB page and her Skype account, and now communicates with her mother in Russia via some sort of Russian Skype Equivalent.
Suddenly, after the complaints, everything was wonderful.
During the Skype and FB communications, she asked about my eldest son's past and steroid use and clearly stated that they had been trying to concieve a baby, but had been unsuccessful. THEN, when she came up pregnant a few months ago, my eldest son said that the pregancy was completely unexpected.
Too many red flags are flapping, here, and I'm going to have to make some decisions about my own choices that will likely be unpleasant.
Thank you for the input, and I believe that I'm sticking with my intuition, here. In the past 5 years, I've done some serious personal recovery and realignments of my personal beliefs and effort to remain objective. The facts are the facts, and my youngest son is overwhelmed by the "possibility" that his sister-in-law "could be" a scammer. He acknowledges that this woman is behaving very badly, and has behaved very badly in the past.
Emotionally, I'm very sad about this situation - it's sad on every level and the baby is, indeed, my grandchild. I can only say this because my son and his wife do not spend a moment away from one another, and it's not the "healthy" kind of attachment. She doesn't work or even drive, and my son is disabled and has always been seriously isolated. It's very unhealthy, and I've read countless articles of how this will likely go down: he's a mess and she's going to accuse him of abuse and/or threats of violence. Because she's married to him, she'll be granted a green card as the baby is a born citizen, and she'll be eligible for every welfare program available, including legal aid. My son, on the other hand, will be forced to pay alimony and child support and there's nothing that I can do to prevent it. It is what it is.
Walking away from this situation is the only thing that I can do, practically speaking. And, I've been practicing separating my feelings from facts, and this situation is rotten from the gate.
I won't tell my son what I believe, or even hint at my concerns. It would only give him a cause to hold onto this sham of a marriage even tighter. Big, "ugh," here but it is what it is.
I'm so sorry to hear that you are going through this.
Another poster suggested contacting the authorities with your concerns about this being a sham marriage. The appropriate agency to call is ICE.
Other than that, there isn't much more you can do. You expressed your concerns to your son and he didn't take your advice. At least you tried---that's the important part.
ICE tends to take green card fraud seriously. Plus stories abound about men marrying a foreign woman who is only in it for the green card. These women, at some point, try to provoke the husband into assaulting them so that they can make the claim of being in an abusive marriage.
I wish you the best when it comes to dealing with this.
Thanks so much, BlueRose - it just is what it is, and there is absolutely nothing that I can do. Even contacting ICE won't have much impact because they're legally married, and that's how she got into the U.S. She didn't come over on a work visa, and that's enough of a red flag, right? Now that she's going to have a baby next month, that'll be the final thing that she'll need to finish her task.
I did a lot of research on this when this woman's behavior began to change, suddenly. Of course, I was verrrrry dubious about the whole thing from the beginning, but my son is a grown man, and he made this decision, himself. To interfere would only make matters worse. And, you know my history and the issues with this son from years back - it's not going to be pleasant.
So, I've accepted the situation as it is, and I realize that there is absolutely nothing that I can do to prevent the inevitable. (sigh) Oh, well.........
Good to "see" you, and I hope that all is well with you! Thanks, again!!!
Well.......I did contact this woman via an assertive (NOT angry) written message to indicate to her that returning gifts and criticizing / complaining about what was gifted is 100% unacceptable in this country. I also pointed out that grandparents are held in high esteem to do for their grandchildren as and how they can. I stated that she needed to contact me using her own email account, or Skype account, or even using her own cell phone, but that my son should not be the go-between.
I received an outrageous rant, this morning, from this woman. It was accusatory, ugly, and of the utmost disrespect imaginable. She went so far as to call me a "racist" with reference to a comment that I made that she didn't understand the customs of this country and that it might create problems for her in the future, since she didn't arrive in this country on a work or student visa - she came into this country strictly on a marriage visa, if there IS such a thing.
I do not care, one iota, about this woman, and my eldest son allowed this whole thing to blow up by misinforming this woman about his past, how many marriages he's had, what the circumstances were that ended each marriage, and that I had somehow had tried to interfere in his second marriage. I never spoke to his second wife and only met her on the occasion when I picked up my youngest son who had been living with them for a short time.
She is now in the TEXTBOOK final phase of isolating my son from his family, will be delivering this child, soon, and she will likely file charge of domestic abuse and/or violence once this child is born. Every aspect of this woman's behavior is listed by the US Embassy as patterns of green card scammers. From arriving in this country at my son's expense, to the marriage within 90 days, and the subsequent drama/trauma and unexpected pregnancy, this final effort to isolate is absolutely noted as predictable.
I am out. I am done. I cannot risk my progress for any man, woman, or child, and this whole episode has made me sick to my stomach.
This morning, I became very sad and angry about this woman's behaviors because I had kept up a false hope that both of my sons and I could enjoy a healthy relationship, finally. Well, that's just not the case. The eldest son is (as I mentioned) Borderline and Cluster B. He has extreme control and anger issues, is an admitted abuser, and he ended up marrying one just as devious as he is, if not more so.
So........a note to parents out there who are trying to mend fences with adult chidlren and feeling guilty for whatever rift that exists: if you have stood accountable for the mistakes that ALL parents make, including ones who escaped dysfunctional dynamics, and apologized to your adult child, you have done as much as you can. The rest is up to them because, as adults, they are making their own choices.
I still love my eldest son and care about his well-being, I will not be drawn into this mess, even if a grandchild is involved. I cannot allow myself to become attached to a human being that I will never have contact with.
First time post on here. I've known for probably the last 6 mo that he is a sociopath. Lies, cheating, tries to make me feel insane. About 2 months ago we got in an argument and lots of shoving took place, police called and he moved out. Of course, 11 days later he writes a long email and I took him back. Last night I confronted him over a "girly" lotion in his car and here we go again. Lies, changed his story...rage when confronted with the truth. Then the violence started. I was punched in the face, bloodied my mouth. Arms twisted, pushed, held down. Then when I ran outside, he threw me down on the ground and kept banging my head. Broke my Cell Phone , finally a neighbor heard my screams and called the police. They arrested him and he spent the night in jail. I went by ambulance to the ER, so many bruises, busted lip, sprained shoulder..... OMG
I kept forgiving him for months Together for 3 years...I should have seen this coming. Charming one moment, then pulled the love away...I kept trying so hard to get his love back...I did everything for him. Get this...he's a freaking doctor...do no harm, Even docs can be sociopaths....
Bruised, I'm so sorry that you've experienced this.
I would like to suggest that you take advantage of every service available through "Victims' Services." If the police were involved, he will face criminal charges that have nothing to do with you.
I would also strongly urge you to file for a restraining order and POA (Protection Of Abuse). You can do this through the civil court and an advocate from Victims' Services will help you through the entire process, from filing and everything else.
Lastly, I would encourage you get involved in counseling, ASAP - strictly with a specialist that deals with abuse, domestic violence, PTSD, and anxiety. There will be peer counseling available, and that's up to you, just as professional counseling will be.
You didn't do anything to deserve this, Bruised. Please, change your CZ ID name because being bruised is temporary - you will survive, recover, and heal from these dreadful experiences just as I did. "SoulfulSurvivor" isn't just a silly name that I chose.
Brightest blessings of healing, comfort, and courage to you.
100% of all women are narcissists, and maybe about half or less of men are.
What we see as an increasing trend are sexy thin narcissistic women in the media making all sorts of money and garnering social status while having essentially no skill or traits to offer society.
The same goes for some men but to a lesser extent, for reasons to be explained later.
So I was wondering today how this came to be from an evolutionary viewpoint, and it seems rather simple.
Narcissism must be a survival trait. With nothing to offer except sexy and thin looks, these women must instinctively realize that narcissism is their only true means to thrive. With no skills, no empathic social offerings, and being the physically weaker sex, it seems that nature has provided narcissistic traits to compete for mates and resources.
Men being the physically stronger sex would not need to rely on these traits as much so this would naturally reflect in a lower percentage of the general male population.
To some extent then, all women must obligatorily
possess narcissist traits in their survival toolbox.
The recent trend has been to condemn these types, to out them, run away, fear them. But perhaps this sheds some light on the matter and makes them less dangerous?
Maybe then even ugly fat women can take pride in their social, nurturing, and empathic resources and not even lower themselves to contempt and jealousy of their narcisstic counterparts.
You are judging people with your ego and not the facts.
Judging in general is a bad habit exercised by people who are not willing to accept the truth or who don't bother to find out the truth.
There are a lot of Narcissists in the world today.
Many more than ever existed. Part of the reason is that people have no defined morale code and no idea of what their life purpose is. These people live free and boundless as if it were all about them. It's called "Confirmation Bias". Meaning that people seek out proof they are right not evidence of the truth. The truth must rule.
The problem is promoted by religion. The religious twist the truth to match their beliefs and it is done by and promoted by every organized religion on the planet.
You think all women are Narcissists because YOU seek out and are only attracted to women who are Narcissists. Change your expectation and you will change the result. But, since you are obviously a full blown Narcissist I'm sure you won't do that. Like attracts like.
Narcissism exists because society promotes the behavior. Successful people, as defined by our culture, all are normally Narcissists. So remember that every time you talk about how wonderful an actor is or how impressive a politician is you are promoting Narcissism.