Hello, I am new here. This is my very first post. I was looking around trying to piece together what else I need to be doing to support my adrenal glands, but I get overwhelmed quite easily since I came off benzos nearly 2 years ago. I am now almost 23 months into recovering from a load of symptoms after many years on a high dose of klonopin. I came off cold turkey in a detox facility in January 2010. Since then it has been quite a ride.
I am still experiencing what appears to be marked symptoms of hypo thyroidism and adrenal fatigue. Which the thyroid is affected by benzos anyways. So now I am trying to get my health in order. I am avoiding dairy, sugar, caffiene, and I eat steamed vegetables, greek yogurt, almond milk, drink carrot juice, and eat lots of spinach and salads, organic chicken...and quite a few other healthy foods.
I just started taking raw adrenal and raw thyroid about 2 weeks ago. I also have eleuthero extract and ashwaganha extract, but don't really know what I am doing. I mean..I know I need to support my adrenal glands and also get my immune system healthy again as they seem to be the longest lasting problems...
My question is....what herbs can I take, how much do I take of them, and where do I get them from ?
I would really appreciate an answer...my life is been horrble for the last 9 years total between being on that medication and withdrawal from it...but its been unbearable for the last 2 years while enduring this horrible long insidious process. I just want my health back...and its slowly getting better....Can someone please help me sort out what herbs can support my adrenal glands and help my stress too ? Thank you in advance and happy holidays
I know you think you are helping by recommending to take an SSRI but that is the worst advice you can give. I have spent almost 2 years reading about benzos and medications like ssri's and fluiroguinolone antiobiotics and Z-drugs like Lunesta and a few others. Those drugs DO cause withdrawal symptoms as they act on GABA. The gaba receptors themselves have been down regulated thus leaving the central nervous system in a hyperexciteable state leaving it SUPER sensitive to many substances including the ones I listed.
Most people in benzo w/d are already sensitive enough without being shocked by further harmful meds like SSRI's. I will NOT go back on another one of these awful medications that damage my central nervous system. I shooudl NEVER have been put on that one in the first place. Furthermore, I have allready seen 8 different doctors over the years and gave them a chance by trying many different medications including SSRI's and NONE..I repeat..NONE of them worked. It took me 8 years to find out that these dcotors were lying to me and that I didn't have an anxiety disorder that ws causing ALL of the symptoms I had for many years. It was the benzo I was on.
So..I will NEVER take another psych drug again...EVER EVER EVER and recommending that to someone in benzo w/d that is already sensitive to medications shows how little you know about what you are talking about. I don't mean to be rude...but I am surprised that I woild get such wreckless advice after explaining that I was in benzo w/d. You may want to do some more learning about benzo w/d and the drugs and other substances that can make it worse.
Sorry, but this is a VERY sore subject with me...and I have faught a long time to get this far...and seeing that advice kinda set me off...again..sorry..I know you don't know any better...but others who are coming off of benzos don't need to go on more drugs. PLus..SSRI withdrawal CAN be very similar to benzo w/d..not identical but it can be bad. Check out paxilprogress.org...those ppeople would also disagree with your advice.
I hear ya, Woody. I'm the one that was offered benzos for my antidepressant withdrawal which was at first called "panic disorder." I took three in all, but instead of calming me down they had the opposite effect so fortunately I stopped taking them. Hveragerthi at The Truth in Medicine, here on curezone is helping me build up my adrenals and balance my hormones naturally and it was at his forum that I found out I'm suffering from protracted withdrawal from antidepressants. through reading the article he posted on his forum about antidepressants actually being prodepressant I found Survivingantidepressants.com where I found identical stories to mine. the adrenals and high cortisol levels are mentioned quite a lot. it was like the last piece to this damned adrenal fatigue puzzle. there are people on there going through benzo withdrawal as well.
I don't know much about the benzo withdrawal, but I do know a lot about cfs/me or adrenal fatigue or whatever you want to call it. If you have benzo withdrawal I don't know anything. But if you have adrenal fatigue cfs/me then taking a low dosage antidepressant IF TOLERATED is definitely a good idea in MOST cases.
That being said, if you are totally against pharmaceuticals because of a bad experience with one drug, I understand. A normal dosage ssri made me suicidal for a few weeks. However, at a low dosage it helps me the most of anything. It really just depends on the dosage and how good your body is at baseline.
Too bad to hear about your health the last few years. I was very interested reading your post since I have experienced a similar path to yours. I was put on klonopin by some stupid doctor for 1-2 years said it would help me with hypoglycemia and other symptoms. Did not know much about those med so I gave it a go. I did not really help me much and the doc kept upping my dosage , at some point I figured it was a dead end so I told him I wanted off . He told me the winter was a good time to stop since your body need less benzo at this time ( this guy was way out there , some kind of weird psychiatrist that was really into seasonal change and hearth attraction kind of thing , ...)
well he told me cut half a pill every week no problem !!!
I did not listen to him I quit the klonopin over a 6 month period just to be on the safe side. I did not go well
I was unable to attend school and bunch of other issue . I felt worse and worse over the summer. My brain has been pretty bad ever since lots of cognitive issues etc etc .
I am not really sure its from the klonopin I was well on my way to af/cfs before might have been a big lack of pacing. But one thing is for sure it did not help.
I restarted a really low dose klonopin after trying many things just to see if it would not help. Did not get much result . I am still taking it because I am not sure my body would handle another withdrawal at this point... but its something I might have to do. Hard to know whats really going on sometimes.
Are you feeling you are gaining some ground since stopping ?? What are your thyroid symptoms. I am also having alot of thyroid symptoms, low body temperature , brain fog etc...
Along what trick already suggested I would probably take the following .
B complex from a multi vitamin or/and supplementing with a natural source like bee pollen witch is really high in pantothenic acid I do both.
I would also agree to give a try out to some kind of mood support . Like trick said a small dosage SSRI could be beneficial. Or a natural alternative like 5htp or st john worts.
For dosage and mood support I can really recommend the book ''The mood cure'' by Julia Ross . Really good advice there for adrenal and thyroid too... I am starting to follow some recommendation with some success.
The 2 best thing for me tough are not supplements but yoga and meditation especially gentle yoga... I use Yoga for stress relief and the anxiety relief exercise is really good.
For herbs dosage and wich one to take I suggest you look on hv forum .
I'm sorry but I have to say I disagree with the advice being given here. I was thrown into full on CFS/AF after a benzo cold turkey and the last thing you want to do is add b complex to an exquisitely sensitive nervous system. Or compound the problem by adding a other pharmecutical. And yes ssris do have a withdrawal,i know many people that have gone thru hell from it. Trix is obviously been lucky so far. The supplements that will help are calming minerals like magnesium, zinc and adding some sulphur to help your liver function since benzos slow down your system and make your liver retain all kinds of things. I would use a low dose of methionine and taurine and NAC down the road. Adrenal cortex glandular is good. The only b to add is b 6 and stay on a low histamine low copper diet till your liver function/ methylation improves and try and reduce your glutamate levels since they rise significantly after benzos due to low GABA....the two go hand in hand. Taurine with also help raise GABA. Also vitamin c from a natural source like orange juice concentrate and make sure it contains bioflavonoids. I'm sorry, I meanno disrespect to the others but I've been thru this and it's nothing to be taken lightly...as Im sure you already know woody.....
A few days ago I popped in to do some reading of the adrenal forum and wanted to say I have garnered a great deal from everything that you folks share here.
I am working to connect some further dots (don't we all) and the exchanges here have really targeted some things I have been dialing in to. For a long time have wanted to drill down into the inflammation issues that lead up to among other things, the tension, the tightness, the strain that one experiences in the middle and upper back and up into the neck. It becomes very easy to use a Ma Roller or an inversion table and have my spine and related areas snap, crackle and pop. This is of course inflammation in the joints... nitrogen, carbon dioxide, etc, being released from the joints. And is no question related to adrenal stress which I've improved immensely over time. But I am still hovering at about 80% with room for improvement.
When I escalate anti inflammatory agents, I can dramatically reduce the release of these joint inflammations. No coinky dink that many of these involve adaptogens that impact the adrenals.
What I have been really following the last couple of days of reading into this forum is a discussion started by Laredo from a couple weeks ago that ranged across a slew of things, not the least of which are the histamine responses. I have arrived at similar results, including the few things to take to that deal with this, so it is most excellent to see all of this exchange of information here amongst ya'll's...
So while I have only been reading backwards into this forum for a short time, wanted to dial in and say thankx to everyone. Correlating things that I have arrived at with discussions here has been very kewl.
Needed to letcha all know that everyone's contributions here are much appreciated.
Yes, the info sharing within adrenal forum has been excellent. Mucho beneficial.
And yes, B6 and VitC, staples here. Connecting these dots, these inflammation dots... thas part of this journey. Working with adaptogens has been integral in this.
And that is one thing I'd really like to hear folks discuss are these neck and backaches and how they as you said "correlate this with the histamine release". This is exactly what led me to this forum. The neck and backache symptoms have been mega barometers for adrenal stress. Am working the last few % towards homeostasis that I know are within reach.
Anywayz, all of the info coming from folks here... A+.
there should not be any sensitivities for everybody with a b-complex and its worth a try.
i take mine part of a natural multivitamin so its more like a b-25 b-50 complex and had no further stimulation from it.
B vitamin are also essential for nervous system function. If synthetic is a problem there is bee pollen wich is really supporting. I remember the first few time I took it I was really stimulated (maybe because my body was very lacking)but now I can take it whenever without a problem or over reaction. The same thing with vitamin c. 1/8 teaspoon of natural c would send me haywire for half a day now I can take 3 teaspoon if I want or more and do not feel any stimulation from it.
We have to remember that we do not respond the same to various supplement and treatment the same way . The poster also quit the benzo 2 years ago if I remember
As far has mood support. I believe it is really important. I suggest your read up the mood cure , alot of natural alternative to support nervous system . There is even some suggestion for benzo withdrawal.
I agree with laredo that gabba support would be important. There is a supplement I will try out called Now true calm wich contain gaba supporting amino acid (GAba , glycine , taurine) .
There also a great deal of people who did great with antidepressant if you struggle with depression . I would for sure give a try out to natural source SJW , 5htp who works really well in some people.
Thanks everyone for the responses. I do take emergen c for now and may try the bee pollen. There ARE sensitivities to B vits in benzo w/d whether you want to realize that or not. I have been dealing with this for quite a while..and have talked to quite a few others for almost 2 years now that are also in benzo w/d. It is common knowlegde that B vits can cause a revving up of an already revved CNS. For those who haven't experienced benzo w/d...you can't possible imagine how horrible that can be. I do get some B vitamins from other sources. I even started taking ORAC super food that has a ton of vitamins and nutrients in, but I still have to be careful as one wrong supplement or substance can lead to heart racing and severe anxiety, muscles spasms, derealisation etc etc. I have these symptoms now...but certain things make them much much worse. So I have to be precautious.
I am more looking for herbs...like what herbs can I take to get my adrenal glands supported. I will not take meds...and I am getting my vitamins.
I just want to know what herbs can help to support the adrenals ? The hypo thyroid stuff I think may be linked to the adrenals as I have never had any of these problems before benzos. I am open to other suggestions as well.
Aswagandha root you can take 1/2 teaspoon 30 minutes before meal 3 times a day. Or capsule 3 times too.
Licorice (I take this one) : I use the now 450 mg capsule 2 times daily before meal. It can help with a bunch of things inflammation cortisol regulation etc..
Bee pollen 1/2 teaspoon 2-3 times a day (check with a really small quantities to verify you have no allergic reactions) . If you get a bit reeved up go slowly. I use to have major sensitivities to supplements. Sometimes if u use for a couple of days it will go away. I tolerate vit c and bee pollen with no stimulation now and no issue. It gives me good usable energy
I also take nettle leaf : 3 times a day 1/2 to 1 teaspoon before meal. Support thyroid function and adrenal.
Thats what I am familiar with.
BTW I understand supp sensitivities. I had a hard time tolerating almost anything it would make me feel like I just took speed. I no longer have those issues since calming my nervous system down alot. And sometimes a supplement cause an initial reaction and then be ok.
Have your read the wilson book on adrenal fatigue ???
I have read your post before. You might have had some sort of allergic reaction to it or to the pollen you got. Or you might be sensitive to pollen. It is not because you had a reaction when trying pollen that pollen is bad and overstimulating for everyone and that you should stay clear of it. It is a very limiting point of view.
I was going trough your 5 pages article and found nowhere that pollen is linked to methamphetamines ( I didnt read every phrase of it tough). Plus the article you provide is full of info on all the benefit of pollen for a wide range of condition.
''During many years of testing, pollen has been notable for its lack of harmful side-effects. Few medications rank with bee pollen in terms of its lack of toxicity. It is a completely natural product that is well tolerated by the body and compatible with all other forms of therapy. ''
But I am sure you can always find an article saying that everything is bad . I can find lots of info that NAC should not be use in treatment of methylation block and might lead to some set back. Yet I wont post about it and start being alarmist because I know it has helped many people I am a firm believer that what works for 1 person might not for the other. There alot of trial and error and unfortunately no one has a clear cut answer to complex health issue like af and cfs. I can do all the research in the end it is what work for you that is important.
my boyfriend also tried it with the exact same reaction...that's why DR. Lam does not recommend it, he also says it's a stimulant. it is stated clearly all over the internet that it's an adrenal stimulant...i am suggesting people research before willy nilly trying a stimulant....as it can backfire...hard
and at the end of several of the articles it says it is structurally related to amphetamines
here are some exerps of an article below and link to that article:
By stimulating the secretion of hormones from the adrenal cortex, bee pollen assists in regulating (1) salt and water metabolism, (2) neuromuscular function, (3) carbohydrate, fat and protein metabolism, (4) resistance to many physical and chemical agents or infections, and (5) increased activity upon hair growth, skin and sexua| functions (including the improvement of secondary sexua| characteristics).
Bee pollen also stimulates both adrenal and liver secretions in order to allow the liver to secrete additional quantities of glycoge, thereby elevating the blood Sugar levels (which greatly benefits those with symptoms of hypoglycemia).
Bee pollen also displays an effect similar to that of the drug amphetamine in that it acts as a "psycho-tonic". However, it does not manifest any depressive side-effects.
I'm curious why you go for B6 but not B5? B6 is involved in histamine synthesis, which seems counterproductive to keeping low histamine. Also, B5 is required for Coenzyme-A synthesis which is required for adrenal function.
Just wondering what your thought process was for using B6 but not B5.
B 6 is actually involved with creating the enzyme DAO which breaks down histamines, dr. Phieffer recommends this for high histamine patients. I haven't found anything connecting it with raising histamnes only the breakdown. Where are you getting that info? B 5 from my research has some mild stimulant type properties so I avoid it. I don't think it's bad, I just don't feel I need it at this stage.....so after I posted the above I did a search on b 5 and though it does stimulate the adrenals it works as a natural anti histamne! Woohoo! Thanx Ali, I may add this to my regiment after all
B 6 is involved in DAO production which is an enzyme that breaks down histamines so maybe that's what they were referencing. it does not raise histamines. i haven't tried histame but read about it.it seems overpriced. i also read the enzyme amylase helps break down histamines too and they are in my digestive enzymes. i have tried methionine, b6 vitamin C with bioflavanoids and the 3 have helped me brilliantly. That along with a low histamine low copper diet. Its been less than 2 weeks my high histamine symptoms are dissapearing quickly:)
I'm with Laredo regarding not adding another pharmaceutical. you can most certainly have withdrawal from antidepressants. I know this Hell first hand and am just barely recovering from it after nearly a year. I was offered benzos to deal with the CFS/severe AF symptoms in the beginning. funny that.
Hey woody, I am in benzo withdrawal and just found out that I have hypothyroidism. I know all to well what you are going through. You really want to stay away from ashwaganha extract!! I'm not sure about the first herb that you questioned about, but ashwaganha is a gaba agonist! I also have been trying to do a lot of research because of my thyroid. Have you ever thought about probiotics? Also I'm totally against any form of anti-depressant pill! I have gone through enough thanks to benzos and have tried so many anti-depressants that I hate any form of them!! It seems that you have done most of your own research!! I am prescribed a low dose of synthroid which I am not comfortable with and only started about two weeks ago. I am pushing for a new Dr as I would rather be on Armour!! I also have read about the gaps diet!! I know that you are very informed about benzos, so you must have already read about Dr. Ashton. She has a story about ashwaganha. I believe there is also a section where she states which herbs are gaba agonist! Good luck!!