I was browsing the forums earlier and saw something about a German method of liver flushing involving mass doses of lecithin. Since lecithin dissolves liver stones , taking enough will theoretically dissolve them all completely. I've been flushing my liver for over a year now and I feel like I'm making no progress. This method is obviously a higher risk procedure since you run the risk of reabsorbing toxins after they dissolve, so I would like to find all the information on it before trying it. Is anyone out here familiar with this?
The theory behind this type of flushing is that a chemical called Phosphatidyl Choline from the Lecithin helps dissolve Gallstones normally combined with a low fat diet. You would take capsules of lecithin which each meal for 3 month as part of a liver cleansing diet. That's about all I remember.
Phosphatidylcholine as soybean lecithin has demonstrated the ability to dissolve Gallstones when used in combination with cholic acid. A study of 7 patients with radiolucent Gallstones and 2 patients with radiolucent calculi in the biliary tree was conducted using 2250 milligrams (mg) of lecithin daily, combined with a 750mg dose of cholic acid over a period of 6 months.  The results showed that in 2 patients, gallstones completely disappeared. Another participant exhibited a decrease in gallstone size as well. This is a clinically significant study indicating the possible benefit of phosphatidylcholine for patients with gallstones. It is important to note that studies have not shown this effect when using phosphatidylcholine alone.
It ends up saying PS alone does not dissolve gallstones.
I am trying Glytamins a product that is very expensive but i see no alternative at this point. I was encouraged at first by this post but It ends up saying PS alone does not dissove gallstones. So i take Lecithin and cholic acid? Where do you get cholic acid?
This was very interesting to read, since Hepato Pro sold by The Life Extension Foundation is Polyunsaturated phosphatidylcholine (PPC). According to LEF, "1800 mg a day protects the liver from noxious materials." After reading your post, I wrote to them about the synergy of PPC with the cholic acid. I hope they add it to Hepato Pro. Do you know of a source for cholic acid? I have been giving my husband Hepato Pro and malic acid for several months in prep for the liver cleanse, and his liver enzymes tested high twice. Based on this experience, I can only conclude that Hepato Pro and malic acid do not replace the need for a liver cleanse. I am hoping now to find cholic acid to add to all the supplements we are taking - artichoke, butyrex, Hepato pro, Epsom Salts before meals, flax oil, and digestive enzymes. Geez, did I miss anything?!
The array of supplements available for the liver is astonishing. The probability is that each claim made the relevant purveyor can be back up with some evidence but in my opinion it is all a matter of probability.
The PPC with the cholic acid evidence appears to be successful in 2.5 out of seven individuals with cholesterol Gallstones that were radio opaque. These individuals were also on a strict diet which excluded fat but we don't know what else in included. If you fit the criteria of the trial this gives you a 35% chance of success of partial gallstone dissolution and 28% chance of dissolving all gallstones. There is no evidence about whether the Gallstones return and there is no evidence that these supplements are suitable for pigment gallstones.
Malic acid has a synergy with pectin. The claim that malic acid dissolves stones is made without much supporting evidence and I have found it difficult to find the evidence. However, I have found some good scientific evidence that there is a relationship between malic acid and pectin both of which are found in apples. The malic acid dissolves the cholesterol in the bile while it is in digestive tract which allows the pectin to chemically bind to the cholesterol. This allows the "old" cholesterol to be evacuated from the body encouraging new cholesterol to be produced by the liver. This cholesterol cycle appears to be a very important mechanism in stopping the growth of gallstones. Pectin has been demonstrated to actually reduce the size of gallstones. It also reduces blood cholesterol levels by around 16% on average. I believe the synergy between malic acid and pectin has become confused over time and today too much emphasis is put on the benefit of malic acid whereas it is the combination of malic and pectin that is so important.
However, PPC with the cholic nor malic acid with pectin have supporting evidence that they dissolve pigment stones. Moreover, none of these supplements tackle the underlying problem that the cause of gallstones may be congestion or damage in the liver. In my view that a liver cleanse by flushing is inevitable at some time following even the best preparation and dedication to the use of supplements.
On several occasions you recommended that people not only use malic acid in preparation of a flush but also pectin. Obviously apple juice or apples have both but not everyone can drink or eat enough of that.
What amounts of malic acid (3 or 9 g per day??) and even more importantly pectin do you recommend in preparation of a flush? How long would you take both. Timing would probably be any time during the day as long as it is with food?
P.S.: This forum is greatly profiting from your knowledge and dedication to serve this community. I remember that some time ago you asked on Andreas old forum what you should do with all your newfound energy. Forgive me if I am mixing something up but I believe it was you. Obviously everyone has to find his/her own way for that. However, I'd like to make a suggestion. With all your knowledge you could write a book on liver flushing. There's only one book by Andreas and I believe there's room and a market for the Telman flush book. Could be a pdf book. It's only an idea... as I know that something like this is a tremendous amount of work of many months.
Thanks again for all your help!
Information with some backup from sound scientific trials indicates that 2 to 3 apples per day as whole fruit or juice is beneficial on a long term basis.
An apple weighs about 175 grams and on average is about 1% malic acid and contains about 0.75% pectin. Depends upon the variety and ripeness of the apple
Based on this a conservative 2 to 3 grams per day of each would equate to 3 apples. It should be taken spread out with a glass of water at meals. The suppliments often come with their own recommendations for dosage and 6 grams or higher may be acceptable. I have read about higher levels of pectin being taken over a shorter period, up to 15 grams per day of pectin over two weeks.
The organic "l-Malic acid" form of malic acid should be used and naturally extracted pectin.